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Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
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Author:  douglas ingram [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
I started this at New Year's and just got strings on this week. I am coming to think of naming this guitar "La Ballena" You'll see why.

I am very inspired by the Torres FE17, and hope to one day have the skills and knowledge worthy of such an undertaking. To prepare myself I built this exploration. Some of the choices for this guitar were also governed by the requirements of the $100 Challenge, which provided the excuse to build it now.

I have included a Tornavoz with this guitar. The original had one, so this one has one, and that's all the justification that I will provide. You all know how controversial the Tornavoz is.

White Pine top.
Green Ash body.
Salvaged Mahogany neck from my first ever build, it was wonky and never got used.
Maple fingerboard.
Rosewood bridge.
Cherry pegs turned by myself.
Walnut binding.
Varnish and shellac finish.
EJ45 strings.
Author:  WaddyThomson [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
It's really cool, Doug! Have you decided on a name yet?
Author:  douglas ingram [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
A couple extra shots.

The sound of this guitar is as good as any other guitar that I have built. Better than some in some ways, maybe not as good as some in other ways. I need to live with it some more to get to know it better. Over all very lively, balanced, and easy to play. Good volume, too. I really did not not know what to expect. She is still very young, strings on only two days, she will mature.

The investigation reminds me of the first guitar that I ever built, when I had nothing to compare to. I have never heard a Tornavoz guitar and I have no one who is familiar with a Tornavoz guitar to examine and provide comment. So I continue to fumble around in the dark.

Whatever the result I still think of this guitar as a success! I have learned so much about the Tornavoz guitar and some of the architectural details of FE17 that I am encouraged to proceed. YES! I will be building another Tornavoz guitar in the future, I just don't know when.

I also think that White Pine should be explored as a tonewood. I would be very interested to learn what others think. And I really like Green Ash so far! Lovely to work with.
Author:  douglas ingram [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
WaddyThomson wrote:
It's really cool, Doug! Have you decided on a name yet?


Waddy, read the first two sentences! ;)
Author:  WaddyThomson [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
OOPS! [headinwall]

You mean "Buffy" didn't make the cut? :D
Author:  DennisK [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Amazing work, I love the heel carving, and the bridge inlays are a nice touch. Headstock could use an inlay or something, although that piece of wood is pretty nice just like it is.

Nifty dark maple fingerboard too. What is it stained with?

I'd love to hear it, if you feel like recording some clips. I don't think I've ever heard either of those tonewoods before, and not many with a tornavoz either :)
Author:  lactose [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 5:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Wow, nice. Are those screws in the tuners ? Do those friction tuners function satisfactorily ?
Author:  Colin North [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 5:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
An interesting project, nicely executed, but if I had a criticism it would be that I feel the Paramo/Pegs headstock in some way clashes with the heel carving and nice touches on the bridge. Or the other way around? Probably just me.
Author:  Alexandru Marian [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 5:20 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
That is really pretty! [clap] Same for the "cheap" wood, it's as nice as lots of spruce or cypress sets costing a good deal. [:Y:]
Author:  Markus Schmid [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 6:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
That's a really charming guitar! Wow! It's like a walk through guitar history: Panormo inspired headstock, Torres inspired bridge, Torres inspired woods? (sometimes Torres had to use the woods that were available/affordable, at least for back and sides), modern heel carving...

Could you tell something about the inlay technique of the center motif of the bridge wings please? (I imagine that this might be somewhat more difficult than a headstock or fingerboard inlay, and those little "pins" are completely sharp).
Author:  douglas ingram [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 8:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Thanks everybody. This guitar is fast becoming a favourite.

This guitar was built as part of the MIMF $100 Challenge. As a result of me being even more frugal than usual, I was faced with certain design restrictions.

Anyone who wants to read through the whole build thread can find it here: http://mimf.com/cgi-bin/WebX?14@202.ftu ... 2cb6b8e3/0
Author:  Markus Schmid [ Fri Mar 12, 2010 9:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Thank you Douglas, I found the detail I was looking for (and a lot more). [:Y:]
Author:  Antonio [ Sun Mar 14, 2010 4:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Beautiful guitar!!!
Do you have some pictures of the tornavoz?
Author:  JohnAbercrombie [ Sun Mar 14, 2010 4:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Antonio wrote:
Beautiful guitar!!!
Do you have some pictures of the tornavoz?


Antonio-
Check out the MIMF link that Doug provided- lots of details there

Cheers
John
Author:  douglas ingram [ Mon Mar 15, 2010 11:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Thanks everyone for the kind words. I learned a lot from doing this guitar. The guitar is playing in nicely now, almost 1 week with strings!

I have made arrangements to borrow a microphone so that I can record this, as well as my other guitars, in order to supply the sound samples that so many of you have requested. I will be very interested to find out your responses. My playing is nothing astounding, but it should provide a sense of the guitar. I don't know if I will have time to secure the services of a good guitar player. I would love to, but we'll see how it goes; I only get the microphone for a couple of weeks.
Author:  oval soundhole [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 3:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
awesome guitar, what is a Tornavoz?
Author:  MaxBishop [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 3:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Wow! Great looking guitar, Doug. Looks like you did a terrific job. Especially with the limit on costs. My hat is off to you. Perhaps some day soon I will venture into my first Torres build. Thanks for sharing.

Best wishes,
Max
Author:  Haans [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 4:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Yes!!!
Author:  StevenWheeler [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 8:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Brian,

A Tornavoz is similar to a port in a loudspeaker. It's a cylinder that extends the sound hole further into the body. Is that makiing sense? I believe Robbie O'Brian did a "Luthiers Tip D'Jour" on the subject.

Steve
Author:  douglas ingram [ Mon Jun 21, 2010 10:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Oh my, I don't check into the forum for a couple of hours and just look at what happens! An old thread gets resurrected! Thanks for the kind words everyone.

If anyone has new questions I will try and answer.

As an update, I never did get to record this guitar. All my plans fell through, but I still have hopes to work something out. My friend who was going to record it is a school music teacher and the end of the school year is even busier than it is regularly. Not an easy gig and it isn't getting any easier.

This guitar is still my "go to" guitar. It is the first one that I reach for and pick up when I want to play anything. I like it a lot, even though it cost me NO new money, and if I had to add up all the actual costs, which I did, it still only adds up to $32.

One of these days, I swear, I'm a gonna build me a guitar with real good materials! beehive
Author:  CWLiu [ Tue Jun 22, 2010 1:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
I like the small whale! It must compensate for a big...
Author:  oval soundhole [ Tue Jun 22, 2010 5:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Did the pine need any time to open up?
Author:  mtracz [ Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Well done Douglas! True inspiration!

I do wish I could view the MIMF entry you linked to. For some reason it is down.

I love seeing expirimental builds with creative budgets. Thank you for posting!!!

Best,
_Mike
Author:  douglas ingram [ Tue Jun 22, 2010 9:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
Mike, the MIMF thread has expired and the MIMF software drops expired threads over the edge of the virtual end of the world.

You can view a parallel posted build thread on the Delcamp Classical Guitar Forum: http://www.delcamp.us/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=47175

The whale carving is a remnant from my very first guitar build waaay back. I screwed up cutting the slots in the headstock, making the sides too thin at the back (wavy action saw blade!) I made a new neck for that guitar but kept this one because of the carving. Awhile back I spliced on a new headstock to salvage the neck. I decided to use it for this build. I had cut a Panormo style head when I did the repair so I didn't have a lot of options.

Remember, the real intention of this build challenge was creativity in the face of frugality!

The Pine opened up similarly to spruce. I can't speak for ALL pine used in guitar building, but this pine top guitar sounds great. At least relative to all of my other guitars.

Pine does have a history of being used for instruments and I do believe that it should be revisited by good tonewood sawyers, suppliers, and instrument builders.

And for the curious, I am including a photo of the tornavoz. This little cone of metal is the subject of much debate. I will not enter that debate here as it leads to much wringing of hands and gnashing of teeth. This guitar is an investigation of the Torres FE17. The original guitar was equipped with a tornavoz and that my friends is all the defense, of my decision to include it, that I will present.
Author:  JohnAbercrombie [ Tue Jun 22, 2010 11:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Doug Ingram's FE17 "Exploration"
EDIT: Doug got back with the info as I was typing! Anyway, delcamp is well worth regular visits if you are interested in classical guitars.

mtracz wrote:
I do wish I could view the MIMF entry you linked to. For some reason it is down.


MIMF is only keeping posts for a month or two these days, after that, they are 'gone into the void', apparently.

Doug was smart enough to parallel post his build at delcamp, where you can read all the details.
http://www.delcamp.us/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=47175

Cheers
John
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