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Caucasian spruce
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Author:  Laurent Brondel [ Fri Dec 31, 2010 9:11 am ]
Post subject:  Caucasian spruce
Have you built with it? And what do you think?
I've had a couple of sets since it seems forever, I get them out once in a while but have never used them. Nice taptone and stiffness, with perhaps more damping than either Euro or red, reminds me a bit of Sitka.
What are your thoughts?
Author:  Dave White [ Fri Dec 31, 2010 10:25 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Caucasian spruce
Laurent,

Colin Symonds made me a Torres style classical guitar with a Caucasian spruce top and kindly gave me a spare Caucasian top then. Earlier this year I totally "re-modelled" an African Blackwood steel string guitar I had made for my 50'th birthday present six years ago that I was never happy I had made a guitar to match the woods "potential". I used the Caucasian spruce top on the guitar called “Féileacán” – the gaelic for butterfly - which has a 13.5" lower bout similar in size to a Martin O sized guitar, 630-660mm multiscale and 13 frets clear of the body.

Image

The Caucasian looks and feels more like Euro than sitka to me (although Lutz is more similar to it) and the guitar is very loud for its size with a very pleasing complexity to it's sound. The guitar is about five moths old now and it has opened up beautifully. I'd build another steel string with a Caucasian spruce top in a heartbeat. Here's two recordings I made with it the first is Ken Nicol's piece "I.H" in DADGAD capo 3 that I recorded a few days after it was strung up:

I.H

The second is my arrangement of the Carol "Gaudete" that I recorded this Christmas in DADGAD (no capo):

"Gaudete"
Author:  Steve Kinnaird [ Fri Dec 31, 2010 10:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Caucasian spruce
Hi Laurent, I've used it once.
Most impressive, with incredible responsiveness all over the guitar's range.
I don't think I've built a better guitar than that particular one.
Of course, it was sitting atop some Brazilian rosewood.

Give it a try.

Steve
Author:  Colin S [ Fri Dec 31, 2010 10:58 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Caucasian spruce
Laurent, as Dave said I have used it quite a bit, but only on classicals, where it is a superb top wood, as well as Dave's guitar I have used it on four other Torres classicals and these are being played by full time professional players who are the senior members of faculty at the RCM, plus the sister guitar of Dave's that was awarded as the Guitar prize last year. To me it is every bit as good as the best Euro or Lutz, much superior to any sitka I've handled. I would have no hesitation of using it on a steel string, to me it is absolutely premium spruce (usual conditions apply!)

I said this before, but the view is held on this side of the pond that a lot of the high end Spanish guitars of the 19th century used Caucasian tops, as the transport of wood was generally by sea around the Mediterranean and wood, including P. orientalis would have come into Spain from the Levant and Turkey along with spices and silk. Builders then couldn't just call Bob for some top wood but used the best 'pine' they could find, they didn't discriminate as to species, probably didn't know.

Lets, face it if it is good spruce you'll make a great guitar out of it whatever.

Colin
Author:  John Mayes [ Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Caucasian spruce
I've used it twice. Very much reminded me of Sitka, which is a good thing!
Author:  Howard Klepper [ Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Caucasian spruce
I also have a couple of sets I haven't used. Very well-quartered and consistent grain; they are AAA to Master depending on the grader.

The color is darker than Euro or red spruce, but not pinkish like Sitka. More of a dull tan. It doesn't have Sitka's pronounced medullary rays or sap vessels.

For some reason (I would have to revisit the sets) when I got them they said "classical" to me.
Author:  DennisK [ Fri Dec 31, 2010 2:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Caucasian spruce
No experience with Caucasian spruce myself, but here's an interesting article from a thread over on the AGF a couple days ago... http://www.lutherie.net/eurospruce.html

EDIT: Oops, I just realized caucasian = p. orientalis, I was thinking carpathian. But still a good article.
Author:  Alexandru Marian [ Fri Dec 31, 2010 2:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Caucasian spruce
Where are those myth busters when you need them.
Author:  Laurent Brondel [ Fri Dec 31, 2010 5:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Caucasian spruce
Dave and Steve, thanks much for the feedback. Colin, the historical perspective is appreciated, it makes sense.
The caucasian spruce I have does not resemble sitka, although it has a subtle pinkish shade, but the taptone reminds me of it.
Dennis, this "essay" surfaces from time to time. I wouldn't know where to begin: there are so many misleading assumptions and plainly wrong, or at best unchecked, facts in it that it is not even worth discussing.
Author:  Howard Klepper [ Fri Dec 31, 2010 8:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Caucasian spruce
Laurent Brondel wrote:
Dennis, this "essay" surfaces from time to time. I wouldn't know where to begin: there are so many misleading assumptions and plainly wrong, or at best unchecked, facts in it that it is not even worth discussing.


If it weren't for this being true, I would say I agree with it!
Author:  mqbernardo [ Tue Jan 04, 2011 5:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Caucasian spruce
Howard Klepper wrote:
Laurent Brondel wrote:
Dennis, this "essay" surfaces from time to time. I wouldn't know where to begin: there are so many misleading assumptions and plainly wrong, or at best unchecked, facts in it that it is not even worth discussing.


If it weren't for this being true, I would say I agree with it!
what is the catch there with euro-spruce, if i may ask?
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