| Official Luthiers Forum! http://luthiersforum.com/forum/ |
|
| Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. http://luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=32336 |
Page 1 of 1 |
| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Thu May 26, 2011 2:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
My friend and the guy who does my clips on my classical guitars, asked me to look at a friend's steel string guitar. The problem is that on the high e, it plays the same note on fret 5, 6 and 7. That tells me that fret 7 is a bit high. The action on this guitar is very low, and the player, a female, has a light touch, and she likes the low action. When I look at the neck, there is no relief, or if there is, I can't see it. Do you think a slight truss rod tweak might solve this problem without messing up the action too much, or is it more likely a high fret situation? I would appreciate some thoughts. I have not actually checked anything yet, other than to eyeball it. I'll put a rocker on the frets and see what I get there before doing anything else, but I feel like a tiny bit of relief might be helpful. Thanks! |
|
| Author: | Chris Ensor [ Thu May 26, 2011 3:22 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
Putting in a little relief might help, but if the 7th fret is too high, that may not fix the problem. I would check all the frets, like you said, for flatness with the rocker, set any that may be high, and see if getting everything level works. If the frets are already level, the action will need to be raised- especially for a light touch type player. At least that is my experience. The action can only be so low. I mean think about it- those strings have to move to generate sound, so if the strings are too low, there will also be a buzz, dead note, or multiple frets all playing the same note. |
|
| Author: | DennisK [ Thu May 26, 2011 3:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
Not sure exactly how best to solve it, but it sounds to me like the ideal would be a compound radiused fingerboard. Cylindrical radius naturally creates a "hump" along the paths of the outer strings, since they're cutting over the cylinder at an angle. |
|
| Author: | Chris Pile [ Thu May 26, 2011 3:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
Let's not get ahead of ourselves, Dennis. Start with the simple stuff - like putting some relief in the neck with the truss rod. Then raise the action a bit, if possible. Then a fret level.... and finally, if all else fails..... a compound radius. |
|
| Author: | DennisK [ Thu May 26, 2011 4:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
Chris Pile wrote: Let's not get ahead of ourselves, Dennis. Dang it, I really have to watch my wording around here. I only meant to illuminate a potential root of the problem, hence the "ideal" and "not sure how best to solve it". Of course simple solutions should be tried first, but understanding the situation is half the battle. |
|
| Author: | woody b [ Thu May 26, 2011 4:09 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
It's a high fret end on the 7th fret. Use a fret rocker to confirm. More than likely the treble end has lifted a little. I'd press it in, and wick some CA around it, while holding it pressed. I suspect it's kinda springy toward the end, hence the CA. |
|
| Author: | Jeff Highland [ Thu May 26, 2011 4:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
I think it's likely to be a high fret, Lack of relief problems generally show in the 1-5 fret area However, I would put some relief in juat to be sure there is no backbow, my preference is for 6- 8 thousandths of an inch. |
|
| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Thu May 26, 2011 7:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
Thanks guys! This is a freebee, so less will be more. I'm not a repair person, and really didn't intend to become one, but couldn't turn down my friend to, at least, try to fix it, if it's minor. I still have not checked the action, but the neck looks totally flat to me, looking down the neck. I can't see any relief at all. The girl who plays the guitar has it set up low so it won't hurt her fingers, according to Johnnie. All the other strings seem to be fine. I suspect that the fret end has popped a bit, and that might solve the problem. 7 is certainly higher that 5 and 6 since you get the note at 7 on all those frets. At 4 you get G#, then at 5 & 6 you get a B. |
|
| Author: | Cocephus [ Fri May 27, 2011 8:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
Waddy, It might be a good idea to try putting a shim under the saddle to see if that doesn`t change things a bit for the better. I did a repair last winter that the customer had removed the under-saddle pickup and wondered why he had so much trouble after that. A couple shims told the story! A new saddle and a truss rod adjustment, and he was on his way. Hope this helps. Coe Franklin |
|
| Author: | TonyKarol [ Fri May 27, 2011 11:32 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
I never "sight" relief .... the easiest way to "see" if there is relief is to hold down the E string at the first fret, and at the fret at the neck joint .. then look for a gap between the string and the top of the 6th or 7th fret. If there is no gap, then there is no relief .. some gap, then there is relief .. shoot for about 5-7 thou ... most people cant see that relief in a neck, as it looks straight. relief or not ... sounds to me like the frets need a spot level .... |
|
| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Fri May 27, 2011 1:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
Thanks Tony, and to all the rest who have given me some good approaches to the problem. |
|
| Author: | theguitarwhisperer [ Fri May 27, 2011 6:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
I do a lot of setup work for fingerstyle guys who like their necks dead flat with super low action. The frets have to be secured so that they are not popping up anywhere, then the frets must be dressed level. If you have a cylindrical radius fretboard, a compound radius can be easily dressed into the fret plane. Final action can be as low as 3/64ths inches on the treble side, rising to 4 or 5/64ths on the bass side at the 12th fret with no buzzing, and appropriate technique, but the frets must be as dead perfect as you can get them. I can even strum energetically at this height, as well as fingerpick, with no buzzing. |
|
| Author: | WaddyThomson [ Fri May 27, 2011 6:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Minor Steel String Adjustment for a beginner questions. |
TA DAA! The guitar is fixed. The 7th fret had popped at the treble end. I CA'd it and clamped it with a fret press. I then went up and down to find high frets with rockers, leveled things generally, and re-crowned the ones I had to adjust, polished things up and put the strings back. It's as good as it's going to get with the action it has - .020 (measured as 0.50 mm) at the 12th fret on the high e. Anyway, it's low. Plays really easy which is what she wants. No finger pain! |
|
| Page 1 of 1 | All times are UTC - 5 hours |
| Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group http://www.phpbb.com/ |
|