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| Fret board screw up http://luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=36752 |
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| Author: | Wendell Harvey [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 7:17 am ] |
| Post subject: | Fret board screw up |
Well, right now I feel like the dumbest stick out there for what I have allowed to happen. I'm building a kit guitar and so the fret board was already slotted and ready to go. I finished the taper to match the guitar neck, cut off the piece where the nut would go and proceeded to finish it up. I laid the fret board on the neck to check final fit, put in the nut and noticed there was a gap between the nut and fret board. When I had cut the end of the fret board my miter saw must have been off square and so the end of the fred board was tapered. I worked with a file to try to square the end but every time I checked it, it was more rounded. I set up my sled on table saw so I could cut the end square. The problem:: Now the distance from the nut to the first fret slot is short by over 1/16". So I am afraid after strings are installed and fretted at first fret the note's will be off. The dimb part:: I went right ahead and installed the fret board, installed the frets and then said, oh oh, this might be a big mistake and now the guitar is a big piece of firewood. All other work is very good and its a beautiful guitar. Any help or comments would be much appreciated. Thanks for reading from a guy who feels dumber than a stick. Wendell |
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| Author: | George L [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:30 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fret board screw up |
I'd try adding add a filler piece between the fretboard and nut (Todd's option #1). |
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| Author: | DennisK [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:32 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fret board screw up |
No problem at all. As Todd says, it's easy to get that bit of string length back by shaping of the nut. Also look up nut compensation, which requires cutting the nut to 1st fret span short just like that. By adjusting the string lengths individually, you can get even better intonation than the standard straight across style. Do be careful when positioning the bridge though. I do my measurements relative to the 12th fret, since that's reliable regardless of whether the guitar uses a compensated nut or not. |
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| Author: | Trevor Gore [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fret board screw up |
A quick and dirty approach to nut compensation which generally works better than no nut compensation, is to move the nut towards the first fret ~1.5mm. You're ~1/16" short = ~1.6mm.... Obviously not as good as individual string compensation at the nut, but first up I'd be doing nothing. If you don't like it, nuts are cheap and read Todd's post. Or look up real nut compensation, which, when I do it, starts with the fretboard 3mm short and then the nut is stepped back a different amount for each string, like this. But then you have to do the saddle differently, too... |
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| Author: | Wendell Harvey [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 10:44 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fret board screw up |
Thanks for all the suggestions. However, I have not made my self clear so will comment further. The fret board is at proper length and the 14th fret is right at the guitar body. The space for the nut is perfect, its just that from the face of the nut to the 1st fret slot I am not at 1.4256" and fall short by over 1/16". It sounds like I just need to be careful when slotting the nut for proper compensation. I also have been following Robert O'Brien's video and have marked the location for the Bridge based on Roberts measurements at the saddle. Do I need to can that info. and do otherwise? Thanks again as you all are great at coming to my aid. Wendell |
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| Author: | Terence Kennedy [ Mon Jun 11, 2012 12:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fret board screw up |
1/16--.0625 is quite a bit of shortening, I actUally just had that happen and added a thin shim of ebony to bring the shortening to around .012-.015 which is the amount I usually compensate the nut. Worked great and As Todd said it was invisible. |
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| Author: | John Coloccia [ Tue Jun 12, 2012 6:08 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fret board screw up |
Wendell Harvey wrote: Thanks for all the suggestions. However, I have not made my self clear so will comment further. The fret board is at proper length and the 14th fret is right at the guitar body. The space for the nut is perfect, its just that from the face of the nut to the 1st fret slot I am not at 1.4256" and fall short by over 1/16". It sounds like I just need to be careful when slotting the nut for proper compensation. I also have been following Robert O'Brien's video and have marked the location for the Bridge based on Roberts measurements at the saddle. Do I need to can that info. and do otherwise? Thanks again as you all are great at coming to my aid. Wendell Soooo.....essentially the situation is that: 1) the nut is too close to the 1st fret 2) you basically compensated by shortening the neck (think about it...you shortened the neck my 1/16"....no biggie) I don't know how you measured out from the bridge, but you're probably going to want to measure that from the 12th fret at this point, if you haven't already, because measuring from the nut location will put you off by another 1/16". Personally, I would get the bridge/saddle in the right place and finish the guitar. Play it, see how you like it. If you think it plays out of tune, it's pretty trivial to stick in shim at the point and to simply make a thinner nut. If you're careful, you could even just thin the nut you have (from the BACK side) and reuse it without haven't to re-slot or anything. It would be a shame to let this opportunity to play around with a compensated nut go wasted considering that the ultimate "fix" is just as trivial to do later as it is to do now. |
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| Author: | Wendell Harvey [ Tue Jun 12, 2012 4:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Fret board screw up |
Would anyone be interested in telling me whether the fret board should be flat before or after installing the frets??? It seems to me that it will change when I string it up. Right now it looks like at the 14th fret down towards the tuners, it's pretty flat until the 5th fret. From there to the nut it slopes toward the nut. I would appreciate any and all comments as I can't continue with finishing this guitar until my errors are corrected. I really want to hear what this thing sounds like so I'll know if I want to build another. It's been an experience for sure and right now I'm dead in the water and can't proceed. Thanks for helping. Wendell Time is not wasted if your only wasting time. |
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