Official Luthiers Forum!
http://luthiersforum.com/forum/

Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy users?)
http://luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=40075		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  jethro16 [ Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy users?)
Hey guys, I know there are a lot of threads on the subject but I was hoping to get some advice with my specific situation. I've got a 1.5hp grizzly dust collector (G1028z2) and I added a ceiling mounted jet air filtration system last fall. I would like to cut down on the dust that is still getting away. After reading through Bill Pentz's site, I realize I need to do that for health reasons as well. Long story short, my shop is in my basement and is about 24'x21'. I have 14" bandsaw, 6" jointer, a 6"x48" belt/disc sander and a supermax 19-38 drum sander. It's just me and I only use one tool at a time obviously. Currently, I'm hooking each machine up to the dust collector as I use it which is a pain and not ideal I know.

I'm looking at 2 options. Option #1 would be to replace the bag on my grizzly with a Wynn canister filter and add a Oneida super dust deputy into the mix.

Option #2 is to just replace the grizzly with one of the Oneida systems like the V-system or maybe even the super dust gorilla if I can stretch my budget. Of course with this option, I'm thinking I would need to run duct work also which isn't cheap I'm sure.

I'm thinking I'm probably going to be doing 3-5 builds/year work schedule permitting. I'm an on call charter pilot so my schedule is very erratic. Anyways, I would appreciate any advice. Main factors are effectiveness, cost and space.

Jeff
Author:  SimonF [ Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
Hi Jeff,
I have a small shop and so setting up duct work is more of a nuisance than an improvement. I had a Grizzly cyclone years ago and it had great suction and did a decent job with filtration; however, I always found that there were numerous leaks due to the fan output connection to the filter and the drum canister connection to the bottom of the cyclone.

I switched to a smaller Powermatic dust collector but it just couldn't meet my needs (I have a wide-belt which really needs good dust collection and dust fines separation). Oneida recently release their Dust Gorilla Portable and it was exactly what I needed. The machine does an incredible job but what I like most about it is the design. The way the filter and drum canister connect to the housing is excellent and eliminates problems with leaks. It also does an extremely good job with dust separation.

It is expensive but is a great tool and something that I highly recommend. I looked at all the other alternatives and this is the best machine by far. Personally, I like the convenience of being able to just wheel the collector to each machine. It only takes me a few seconds and I know that I am getting really good suction because the hose is fairly short (I just a 6" flex hose about 8' long).

Image
Author:  WudWerkr [ Tue Apr 16, 2013 1:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
All said and done Jeff , You can never catch it all .
Author:  bluescreek [ Tue Apr 16, 2013 2:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
I have a Grizzly Cyclone
wish I had something else I am looking at Oneida also
Author:  jethro16 [ Tue Apr 16, 2013 5:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
Thanks for the advice so far guys. Simon: I hadn't even looked at their portable stuff for some reason. Thanks for pointing me in that direction. Do you have the 3hp model?
Author:  Stuart Gort [ Tue Apr 16, 2013 6:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
After operating for quite some time in a large shop...having to roll a cyclonic vacuum system around and reconnect to everything...I can appreciate WudWorker's advice. Hooking up a vacuum straight to the device, whether it be a bandsaw, radial saw, or any other type of sander or saw is only partially effective. It's way better than nothing to have the vacuum but since it isn't 100% effective you'll have to clean it up anyway.

My approach is going to be to isolate the dust making tools with an industrial plastic curtain...and then construct the tables to allow for easy sweeping of the floor after blowing it all off with compressed air. I'll be able to sweep to a vacuum collector in a corner on the floor.
Author:  DeanP [ Wed Apr 17, 2013 7:19 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
If you're serious about dust collection, a cyclone is the way to go. As was mentioned above, spend some time on Bill Pentz's site. Its a very good place to get some education on the ins and outs of dust collection and how much air you really need to move to do it right. Prior to last October my dust collection amounted to a 1.5 hp Powermatic bag system and a Jet ceiling mount air filter in my 20' x 30' shop. The entire shop was covered with fine dust and I too was becoming concerned with the health aspects of a dusty shop.

In October I installed a Clear Vue CV1800 cyclone and replaced most all of the 4" ducting I was using with 6". WOW! What a difference. No more fine dust in the shop and I rarely have to sweep the floor anymore.

John, I recall you commented in the past about the Grizzly cyclone and the issues with the cartridge filter. I know I don't do anywhere near the volume of work in my shop that you do, but I'm retired and out in my shop every day. In six months, I don't think I lost any capacity in my system due to plugging of the pleated filters. I've tapped them down several times to see how much fine dust they have collected and after six months I may have knocked a total a tablespoon of dust out of them. As you and and every other dust collector owner well knows, if the fine dust can make it to the fine filters, its not long before the collection system is virtually useless because the static pressure/air flow has fallen below what's needed to collect the fine dust at the machine.

I have no experience with the Oneida and I'm sure it's an excellent cyclone. But I can say for certain that the Clear Vue does a super job of capturing the fine stuff and preserving the pleated filters and more importantly maintaining the airflow.

Just my $0.02 (And probably just barely worth that) :)

Dean
Author:  Mark Fogleman [ Wed Apr 17, 2013 8:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
Zlurgh wrote:
It's way better than nothing to have the vacuum but since it isn't 100% effective you'll have to clean it up anyway.



I would argue that collecting dust and filtering the air poorly (ie: inadequate filtration of the <1.5 micron particles) is much, much worse than doing nothing if your goal is cleaning the air. Do it poorly and your dust collector becomes a fine dust nebulizer and only traps the big stuff.

An inexpensive way to HEPA filter your shopvac is using a Gore Cleanstrean HEPA filter cartridge. ~$30 at Lowe's. It is reusable and easy to clean with soap and water. Mine is ~10y/o and still works great with regular use. Add a pre-separator... not the common trashcan lid style...google Thein dust separator for a good DIY option or go with one of the retail mini cyclones from Oneida, Clearvue or the new vortex one. No need to go crazy with this if you occasionally use your shop. Try to wait to the last thing to sand and wear a good mask.
Author:  Goodin [ Wed Apr 17, 2013 12:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
I recently got a Delta 1.5 bag dust collector. I immediately replaced it with a Wynn Env. canister filter so I never got a chance to compare the canister filter with the stock bag filter. I am currently hooking up the stock ~6' long 4" hose to each machine as I go and it seems to do an adequate job.

I have a Dylos air quality monitor and the readings rarely get over 4000 while using my drum sander with my current dust collector set up. But the Dylos reads 150 or less as "excellent" air quality, 1000 or less as "fair" air quality, and 3000+ is "very poor" air quality. For comparison, I ran my table saw without dust collection and the Dylos read over 30,000+!!!! I always wear a respirator when doing machine work, even with the dust collector going, and have my air filtration system going full on.

Lately I have discovered that a basic box fan with a 20"x20" filter taped to the back of it makes a VERY effective air filter if used as close as possible to the dust source. My Dylos monitor usually stays below 1000 when I have the box fan filter running. I am going to set up a few of these in my shop.

I am thinking I will get the super dust deputy so I would basically be running your option #1. I am not sure the dust deputy would increase CFM's to the machine, you just wouldnt have to clean out the dust collector filter near as much. I could be wrong...would like to hear others opinions on the super dust deputy and CFMs.
Author:  SimonF [ Wed Apr 17, 2013 1:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
I have adapted all my machines to have a 6" diameter attachment -- this makes a dramatic difference in dust collection at the machine. You can get by with less but a cyclone is simply worlds apart in terms of performance than the typical sub-$1000 shop dust collectors. When I run my wide belt, joiner, spindle sander, shaper, or disc sander -- I get absolutely no dust remaining except some heavier shavings that might fall to the floor. The bandsaw is much trickier and I need to rework the dust shrouds to improve collection. The point is that if you redesign some of the machine dust shrouds and have a powerful dust collector, you will be able have an extremely clean shop and dust-free shop. Don't just expect to be able to hook up a 4" hose to your machines and get perfect dust collection.

That said, if you are looking for portability, then the Oneida product is absolutely superb. I have the 3hp variant and have been extremely happy with the quality and performance.
Author:  bluescreek [ Wed Apr 17, 2013 3:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
yes I hear good things about clear vues
Author:  Bob Shanklin [ Wed Apr 17, 2013 4:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Dust Collection Need some advice (Super dust deputy user
I have a 2HP collector with the canister filter and a Super Dust Deputy. No dust is going into the collector, it is all going into the 35 gallon drum the Deputy is mounted on. Great for my confined dust making area. Still wear a good mask though.

Bob
Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC - 5 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
http://www.phpbb.com/