Official Luthiers Forum!

Owned and operated by Lance Kragenbrink
It is currently Thu Mar 28, 2024 5:14 am


All times are UTC - 5 hours


Forum rules


Be nice, no cussin and enjoy!




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 30 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 12:15 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:20 am
Posts: 2593
Location: Powell River BC Canada
First name: Danny
Last Name: Vincent
Good Day All,

I'm just cleaning up a binding job with Zipflex purfling. Looks great. Love that stuff to work with.

I've set the Zipflex a hair below the Spruce accept for about a 2" section where it is pretty much flush.

Obviously I'm going to be very careful and not sand the crap out of it but how much of a good shell layer is there on the surface? Anyone have any idea? I'm just wondering HOW careful I have to be.

Cheers,
Danny

BTW. BTW. FWIW. First guitar I have not used CA for the bindings. Likely won't be going back. This was a far more enjoyable and found it much easier to do a mostly perfect job. :D


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 12:33 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:21 am
Posts: 3288
First name: Brad
Last Name: Combs
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
I've never used Zipflex, but I'm surprised to hear you say that going away from CA was easier. Can you describe that in more detail? My forehead beads up with sweat just thinking about trying to get the joints on binding to look decent. Today I use titebond. I tend to get good results on the joints at the butt end of the guitar, but that top joint on the back binding is never a treat. I use the mini miter trick that Terrence Kennedy shared, but I still sweat bullets the whole time. :D

_________________
Insta - https://www.instagram.com/cbcguitars/
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/cbcguitars


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 1:37 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 10:44 am
Posts: 6232
Location: Virginia
I love Zipflex too, it's fantastic. By the way that you describe it you have no worries at all. If it's 'a hair' below or flush then sand away as normal. As an educated guess I'd say you got about 1/16th inch of solid abalone before you might bottom out, I never actually tested it though. As for gluing in Zipflex I can't imagine using anything other then CA, it's perfect for it. But I'm sure Titebond along with the bindings would work well too.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 1:52 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:20 am
Posts: 2593
Location: Powell River BC Canada
First name: Danny
Last Name: Vincent
To sum it up, everything is easier and better. Butt joints are perfect. On Maple. And don't even get me going on how much I did not enjoy cleaning up the side binding with ca. My least favourite task always. I just finished. Wow! So much easier, cleaner and faster. I'm sure ca soaks into the binding and makes it more difficult to level. I've always had slight variation in binding thickness when finished. Generally only detectable by me, but non the less pissed me off. Not today my friend. And the rest of the clean up is just soooo much easier. Another aspect that i hope it will improve. The pesky gaps that show up with the first coat of nitro. Seems no matter how hard I try to fill them, they always show up and require drop filling after.

Zipfex ? anyone?



These users thanked the author DannyV for the post: nathanpeirson (Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:24 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 1:58 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:20 am
Posts: 2593
Location: Powell River BC Canada
First name: Danny
Last Name: Vincent
jfmckenna wrote:
I love Zipflex too, it's fantastic. By the way that you describe it you have no worries at all. If it's 'a hair' below or flush then sand away as normal. As an educated guess I'd say you got about 1/16th inch of solid abalone before you might bottom out, I never actually tested it though. As for gluing in Zipflex I can't imagine using anything other then CA, it's perfect for it. But I'm sure Titebond along with the bindings would work well too.


Perfect! And thanks for that. I may run a bead of ca around the shell.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 5:01 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2011 1:32 pm
Posts: 3470
First name: Alex
Last Name: Kleon
City: Whitby
State: Ontario
Zip/Postal Code: L1N8X2
Country: Canada
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
What glue did you use, Danny?

Alex

_________________
"Indecision is the key to flexibility" .... Bumper sticker


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 6:06 pm 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo
User avatar

Joined: Fri Oct 31, 2014 9:33 pm
Posts: 305
Location: Mount Vernon, Ohio
First name: Greg
Last Name: Maxwell
City: Mount Vernon
State: Ohio
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
If memory serves there is about .050 of shell, plenty to sand. I use zipflex a lot and have never had any issue with sanding it. I use CA to install the zipflex and B&W purflings and can't imagine anything being easier. I do use Titebond or LMI yellow for wood bindings, and then flood the zipflex with CA again before sanding and scraping everything flush.

_________________
It will probably be alright.



These users thanked the author Greg Maxwell for the post: DannyV (Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:15 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:18 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:20 am
Posts: 2593
Location: Powell River BC Canada
First name: Danny
Last Name: Vincent
Alex Kleon wrote:
What glue did you use, Danny?

Alex

Titebond Alex. But what Greg said above makes pretty good sense. It is a binding, B/Pear/B, Zipflex layup. Somewhere in there may be a little starved for glue.

Thanks all!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:00 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member

Joined: Sun May 19, 2013 10:22 am
Posts: 727
First name: Brian
Last Name: McDonald
City: Okanagan Centre
State: British Columbia
Zip/Postal Code: V4V2H6
Country: Canada
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
Pics, or its just all talk.

B

_________________
My memory is so good, sometimes I remember things that never happened.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:29 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:35 pm
Posts: 2951
Location: United States
First name: Joe
Last Name: Beaver
City: Lake Forest
State: California
Focus: Build
I've used zip flex several times. It is great stuff. I'm not sure how much you can sand it. I just treat it like ablam and don't sand any more than necessary.

_________________
Joe Beaver
Maker of Sawdust


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 11:15 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:20 am
Posts: 2593
Location: Powell River BC Canada
First name: Danny
Last Name: Vincent
Bri wrote:
Pics, or its just all talk.

B

Hahaha. Give me a chance to clean it up Brian. I just flooded it with ca last night.

I'm liking this one. It's a dread, which I don't build many of. A very old and beautiful Taz Blackwood set and Stellar Bearclaw Sitka. Customer wanted a 4 3/8" sound hole. Cool eh! A commission for a really nice guy. I've kept him up to date daily with progress pics via text. It's very enjoyable for both of us and only takes a second.

Pics later today maybe.

Cheers Pal!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 1:32 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member

Joined: Sun May 19, 2013 10:22 am
Posts: 727
First name: Brian
Last Name: McDonald
City: Okanagan Centre
State: British Columbia
Zip/Postal Code: V4V2H6
Country: Canada
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
I seem to recall someone getting a hard time for building dreads.
Probably just a dream.

B

_________________
My memory is so good, sometimes I remember things that never happened.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 9:53 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 10:44 am
Posts: 6232
Location: Virginia
DannyV wrote:
jfmckenna wrote:
I love Zipflex too, it's fantastic. By the way that you describe it you have no worries at all. If it's 'a hair' below or flush then sand away as normal. As an educated guess I'd say you got about 1/16th inch of solid abalone before you might bottom out, I never actually tested it though. As for gluing in Zipflex I can't imagine using anything other then CA, it's perfect for it. But I'm sure Titebond along with the bindings would work well too.


Perfect! And thanks for that. I may run a bead of ca around the shell.

That's a good idea. You can notice that the pieces are 'loose' withing their ZipFlex tracks. Tacking them down good with thin CA will set the min stone.

BTW left over ZipFlex pieces from bigger guitar projects are awesome for smaller projects like this Uke...

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 10:11 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:20 am
Posts: 2593
Location: Powell River BC Canada
First name: Danny
Last Name: Vincent
I'm happy! I would like to call this sexy but it is a dread. beehive I do get the allure of the dread though. Such an amazingly unique sound. I'm really looking forward to string this one up. The customer wanted an enlarged sound hole and I was all over that. This would look really nice with understated, minimal inly on the FB. He is however big on shell. I made the mistake of sending him to DePaule website. That was a mistake but I did manage to talk him out of making it look like a banjo.
From a builders prospective life is so much easier building a guitar not having a tight waist. Hours less time and zero stress bending.
Cheers!
Attachment:
rsz_100_6644.jpg

Attachment:
rsz_100_6645.jpg

And thanks for your help!


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 11:53 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 10:44 am
Posts: 6232
Location: Virginia
looks great!



These users thanked the author jfmckenna for the post: DannyV (Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:21 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 12:00 pm 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo

Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2009 10:52 am
Posts: 133
State: PA
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
I removed the backing from a small scrap of Zipflex. The thickness of the shell itself measured 0.049" (i.e., 0.050" as previously noted). Note that if you sand too much, the color of the underlying surface can be different from the unsanded surface.



These users thanked the author SteveT for the post: DannyV (Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:21 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 5:25 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:12 pm
Posts: 6977
First name: Mike
Last Name: O'Melia
City: Huntsville
State: Alabama
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
In the event that you are flooding with CA where spruce might be nearby, be aware of the "ca wicking and discoloration" issue. CA can turn beautiful spruce yellow. Where end grains are exposed. This issue is not repairable (there are techniques to compensate). -Mike



These users thanked the author Mike OMelia for the post: DannyV (Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:22 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:23 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:20 am
Posts: 2593
Location: Powell River BC Canada
First name: Danny
Last Name: Vincent
Mike O'Melia wrote:
In the event that you are flooding with CA where spruce might be nearby, be aware of the "ca wicking and discoloration" issue. CA can turn beautiful spruce yellow. Where end grains are exposed. This issue is not repairable (there are techniques to compensate). -Mike

Shellac is my friend Mike. [:Y:]


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Sun Jul 09, 2017 6:53 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member

Joined: Sun May 19, 2013 10:22 am
Posts: 727
First name: Brian
Last Name: McDonald
City: Okanagan Centre
State: British Columbia
Zip/Postal Code: V4V2H6
Country: Canada
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
Nice Danny, looks you're getting the hang of it.

B

_________________
My memory is so good, sometimes I remember things that never happened.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 3:46 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:20 am
Posts: 2593
Location: Powell River BC Canada
First name: Danny
Last Name: Vincent
Bri wrote:
Nice Danny, looks you're getting the hang of it.

B

Thanks Brian. I am always looking for new and creative ways to screw up. I find them regularly. Fortunately I'm a good carpenter too. ;)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 10:17 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 9:12 pm
Posts: 6977
First name: Mike
Last Name: O'Melia
City: Huntsville
State: Alabama
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
DannyV wrote:
Mike O'Melia wrote:
In the event that you are flooding with CA where spruce might be nearby, be aware of the "ca wicking and discoloration" issue. CA can turn beautiful spruce yellow. Where end grains are exposed. This issue is not repairable (there are techniques to compensate). -Mike

Shellac is my friend Mike. [:Y:]


Just saying.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 2:54 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:35 pm
Posts: 2951
Location: United States
First name: Joe
Last Name: Beaver
City: Lake Forest
State: California
Focus: Build
DannyV Posted
Attachment:
rsz_100_6645a.jpg


I really like how you used the radial wood with the pearl. Love the look.
How did you do the radial?


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

_________________
Joe Beaver
Maker of Sawdust


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:38 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 3:20 am
Posts: 2593
Location: Powell River BC Canada
First name: Danny
Last Name: Vincent
Hey Joe. (!!!) If you are referring to the rosette, it's not radial. High Curl Maple. Bent on the pipe and a touch scorched unfortunately. More so on the treble side but I think it will all work out.

BTW. If anyone is interested. AST has a deal on random lengths of Green Abalone Zipflex right now. Like 40% off deal. And they will ship to Canada. How that works I have no idea because i didn't ask too many questions. ;)



These users thanked the author DannyV for the post: Pmaj7 (Wed Jul 26, 2017 2:16 am)
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 1:25 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:35 pm
Posts: 2951
Location: United States
First name: Joe
Last Name: Beaver
City: Lake Forest
State: California
Focus: Build
Thanks Danny. I like the idea of using curly maple!
It looked like the pieces were bent. I couldn't quite figure out how to do that with end grain zebra wood.

And thanks for the tip on zipflex. I'll check it out

_________________
Joe Beaver
Maker of Sawdust


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Zip flex ???
PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:01 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1700
DannyV wrote:
Hey Joe. (!!!) If you are referring to the rosette, it's not radial. High Curl Maple. Bent on the pipe and a touch scorched unfortunately. More so on the treble side but I think it will all work out.

BTW. If anyone is interested. AST has a deal on random lengths of Green Abalone Zipflex right now. Like 40% off deal. And they will ship to Canada. How that works I have no idea because i didn't ask too many questions. ;)

Ast?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 30 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 61 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
phpBB customization services by 2by2host.com