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| StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 http://luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=50554 |
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| Author: | nathanpeirson [ Sun Apr 22, 2018 5:01 pm ] |
| Post subject: | StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
I have the StewMac 00028 plans and am considering using them for an upcoming build. I was thinking I might build an OM28 instead and wondered if just lengthening the neck and fretboard scale is enough. Is there something else I am missing? Everywhere I look they say the bodies and construction are the same. |
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| Author: | Woodie G [ Sun Apr 22, 2018 6:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Different body and neck. It's confusing until you realize that Martin used different body shapes for the 12 and 14 fret versions of the 0, 00, 000, and D. The McRostie 000-28 plans are for a 12 fret body and neck, while the OM is a 14 fret 000 body and 14 fret neck. |
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| Author: | Terence Kennedy [ Sun Apr 22, 2018 7:11 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Like Woody said, the 000 12F actually has the same 25.4 scale as an OM but a much different body shape with an elongated upper bout. I think Martin just shortened the upper bout to get 14 frets and left the bridge in the same place and the lower bout identical when they created the Orchestra model. A Mahogany 000 12F is a great guitar and has been a popular model for me. There is more volume inside the box because of the extended upper bout and maybe that is why they sound cool. If you are going to build an OM I’d probably use OM plans to get the body shape right. |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Sun Apr 22, 2018 8:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Didn't StewMac offer a 14 fret triple O plan at one time? |
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| Author: | Freeman [ Sun Apr 22, 2018 9:02 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
To further confuse matters, Martin has made both long and short scale 000's as well as 12 and 14 frets clear. OM's are alway long scale and 14 frets. there is a good description of the differences here https://umgf.com/000-vs-om-t5309.html My first guitar was a long scale 12 fret 000 using the SM plans - I still play it after 12 years. I just built my 24th guitar - a true OM - and used the Antes plans from LMII but lightened the bracing considerably. Had to build a new side bending mold for my Fox and a new body mold for the guitar. Ps - as always, make sure your guitar design will fit a standard case - saves a bundle |
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| Author: | nathanpeirson [ Sun Apr 22, 2018 9:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Since I feel I will need to get another set of plans for an OM, does anyone have any experience with the Georgia Luthier supply? They offer a set of 14 fret OM plans. Or, does anyone have suggestions? |
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| Author: | klooker [ Sun Apr 22, 2018 10:51 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Download the Grellier plans & get them printed at a blueprint shop or a Kinkos |
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| Author: | bluescreek [ Mon Apr 23, 2018 5:23 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Agree Griellier plans are as good as what is out there . The plans by Antes are horrid. Georgia Luthier plans are also not close to the Martin design and they will state they are. Martin is trying to find the owner to get them to stop stating that. I am a Martin Authorized center and make the molds for GMC. The OM and 000 14 fret are the same shape . They did change the shape a few times through the history . Martin changed the body as mentioned above from the 12 to 14 fret and changed the neck . The height at the tail is 4 1/8 at the neck I have seen them 3 3/8 . Not hard at all once you understand the Martin philosophy of guitar building there are no true Martin plans out there for these shapes. In fact there wasn't a blue print for anything at Martin until Dick Boak was hired in the 70's . I do have tracings and can help you there but I know of no official print available as Martin does have these protected under proprietary information. |
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| Author: | Terence Kennedy [ Mon Apr 23, 2018 7:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
I built a Martin OM kit in the 90’s and they sent a cardboard template for the body shape. That is what I used when I started building from scratch, made a plexiglass copy. Figured it was as close as a guy could get. I had the brace layout from the kit markings and ordered a set of profiled but unbent sides from the 1833 shop and used them for the side templates. Figured it was a good starting point and it was. |
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| Author: | Clinchriver [ Mon Apr 23, 2018 7:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Waldron Instruments make an excellent pre-war era OM 14 fret template (and many others) I have tracings from John Arnold and Blues Creek and while there are minor differences between all three, your definitely in the ballpark. It would take being able to measure and take notes from actual guitars to sort it out. FYI Bluescreek molds are some of the best. |
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| Author: | nathanpeirson [ Sat Apr 28, 2018 5:04 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Trying this one again. Here is a pic of the StewMac 12 fret 000 (DIY plexi pattern) over the Grellier 14 fret OM plans I had printed. Looks like the SM extends the upper bout to the 12th fret. My question is, how does that effect tone between the two?  Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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| Author: | Freeman [ Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:28 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
That is exactly the way I like to describe the transition from 000-12 to OM, Martin pushed the top curve down from the 12th fret to the 14th. As I recall the lore that was done to make a neck more to the liking of a banjo player who thought he needed access to the 14th frets. Here is an OM built from the Antes plans but the body was bent using a Bluescreek form which people seem to feel is pretty much correct and a 000-12 built from the StewMac plans. Both guitars are long scale, the bracing is slightly different because the plans are different (and the OM is cedar, the 000 is spruce). Crappy pictures, I'm sorry, but it should give you some ideas Attachment: IMG_4479-3.jpg Attachment: IMG_4478-3.jpg Btw - don't get confused by the double dot at the 9th fret of the 000 - I don't remember why I did that LOL. Line up the nuts and the 12th fret of the OM with the body joint on the 000, and the bridges |
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| Author: | Clay S. [ Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
The 14 fret body has a wider upper bout than the 12 fret body (11 1/4 vs 10 3/4). What does the Grellier plan use? |
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| Author: | nathanpeirson [ Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:56 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Clay S. wrote: The 14 fret body has a wider upper bout than the 12 fret body (11 1/4 vs 10 3/4). What does the Grellier plan use? It appears Grellier’s upper bout is about 11 1/4”. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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| Author: | nathanpeirson [ Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:00 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Freeman wrote: That is exactly the way I like to describe the transition from 000-12 to OM, Martin pushed the top curve down from the 12th fret to the 14th. As I recall the lore that was done to make a neck more to the liking of a banjo player who thought he needed access to the 14th frets. Here is an OM built from the Antes plans but the body was bent using a Bluescreek form which people seem to feel is pretty much correct and a 000-12 built from the StewMac plans. Both guitars are long scale, the bracing is slightly different because the plans are different (and the OM is cedar, the 000 is spruce). Crappy pictures, I'm sorry, but it should give you some ideas Attachment: IMG_4479-3.jpg Attachment: IMG_4478-3.jpg Btw - don't get confused by the double dot at the 9th fret of the 000 - I don't remember why I did that LOL. Line up the nuts and the 12th fret of the OM with the body joint on the 000, and the bridges Beautiful guitars. I love the rosette on the 12 fret. What wood is that! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk |
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| Author: | Freeman [ Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:05 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
nathanpeirson wrote: Beautiful guitars. I love the rosette on the 12 fret. What wood is that! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Thank you. The 12 fretter is Sitka with just a huge amount of bearclaw. The rosette is pretty simple abalone with a couple of purfling lines. In retrospect I wish that I had used something other than plastic binding but that was my first guitar and I had a lot to learn. It is twelve years old now and the lacquer (and probably the top) have started aging pretty nicely - there is no toner in the finish. And even tho it was my first guitar it still is my go to - still crazy after all these years. Here is one more 000 vs OM picture. The twelve string is an OM body, but it is also short 24.9 scale. The 000 is that same one, 12 fret long scale. One thing to notice is how much the bridge is pushed down into the lower bout - that of course ripples thru the whole bracing scheme  and one more thought that I learned the hard way - be sure to compare your plans to commercially available cases. If a guitar is a half inch wider or deeper or something and won't fit a standard case things can get real expensive real fast |
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| Author: | Ruby50 [ Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:47 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: StewMac 00028 plans to OM28 |
Here is a picture of two vintage Martins - one a 14 and one a 12 fret 000. Note the lower bouts are identical, the bridges and nuts are at the same heights, and the sound holes are the same size and in the same place. I am not schooled on this, but it seems the 12 fretter is gut strings and has a wider neck. If I recall, the picture is from Robert Corwin's fantastic collection |
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