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First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
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Author:  doncaparker [ Sun Jun 17, 2018 9:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
Julie—

The binding sand through you experienced may merely be the result of a messed up router jig, but there is another, more common cause that could be a contributing factor. If you put any side refinement off until after the binding is on, you run the risk that you will thin out the binding too much along with the side.
Author:  Jules [ Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:47 am ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
Ruby50 wrote:
I am like, you, Jules. I do a lot of other woodwork, and guitars are the first time I have had to use a micrometer. Starting with the first one (now on #8) I have taken pretty extensive pictures of what I did. For my next guitar, I always look back and frequently find a way to improve a step - something I have learned from others or thought of on my own - and photograph that for next time. Others may benefit from writing things down or talking into a recorder, but some record of what you did .

That's pretty a pretty good description of my experience. When I made my first Strat, I bought a digital caliper and a few other micro-measuring tools. I also found taking lots of pictures very helpful. Though I'm not taking nearly as many on this build as I have with my other guitars.

Ruby50 wrote:
I never make the same mistake twice - there are so many new mistakes to make, why waste time.

Good code to live by. [:Y:]
Author:  Jules [ Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
doncaparker wrote:
The binding sand through you experienced may merely be the result of a messed up router jig, but there is another, more common cause that could be a contributing factor. If you put any side refinement off until after the binding is on, you run the risk that you will thin out the binding too much along with the side.

Before routing for the binding, I sanded the sides from 80 to 180 grit, until they were pretty much done. The problem was I simply failed to check the depth of the rout before gluing on the binding. Knowing what sipo does to me, I was more focused on avoiding breathing the dust than double checking things. I've still got the neck to finish and the inevitable sipo dust is scaring me.
Author:  Freeman [ Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
According to the wood database (link posted here a few weeks ago) Utile (aka sipo) has

Allergies/Toxicity: Although severe reactions are quite uncommon, Utile has been reported to cause skin irritation. See the articles Wood Allergies and Toxicity and Wood Dust Safety for more information.

If you are reacting to it you may have other sensitivities. I won't lecture you on all the stuff you already know, but having just built a guitar out of cocobolo I'm pretty aware of suiting up before doing any work. The thing that is really bad for me is that I'm turning out to be really sensitive to CA glue and I use CA for everything. I keep thinking "one little drop without the respirator won't hurt" and then I'm hacking for three days.
Author:  Jules [ Sat Jun 23, 2018 8:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
Freeman wrote:
If you are reacting to it you may have other sensitivities. I won't lecture you on all the stuff you already know, but having just built a guitar out of cocobolo I'm pretty aware of suiting up before doing any work. The thing that is really bad for me is that I'm turning out to be really sensitive to CA glue and I use CA for everything. I keep thinking "one little drop without the respirator won't hurt" and then I'm hacking for three days.


I was thinking about CA possibly being another culprit but it's never bothered me in the past. I haven't used it extensively, though. When I glued on the top binding, I used PVA glue. It was a bit of a circus and I wasn't crazy about the end result. So when I glued the back binding I went with CA. After that set, I sanded the sides and had the worst reaction to date. I blamed it completely on sanding the sipo sides even though I wore a respirator the whole time. But for the CA, I had no protection. What baffled me was I had done another project with the same wood and didn't have any issues. But I didn't do as much hand sanding so I blamed everything on the hand sanding. Now I'm wondering if the real culprit was the CA.

Yesterday I was making rope stropped blocks using the sipo (already had that in the works before dreading using the wood) and had so many things going to protect myself from the dust - respirator, HEPA filter, gloves, HEPA vacuum - woodworking was no longer enjoyable. When working with cocobolo, I just wear a respirator and I'm fine. I've been thinking sipo is my demon wood. Whatever the case, next CA use will include a vapor respirator. I'm starting to miss the good old days of no PPE. :roll:
Author:  Clay S. [ Sat Jun 23, 2018 11:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
If you don't want to redo the binding paint the side of the sand thru the color of the outer layer and it will be less noticeable (faux finishing 101). I make the binding a bit thicker, so even if it is not totally uniform in thickness the variation is less obvious. A single layer of binding without purfling looks O.K. on the back.

"I've still got the neck to finish and the inevitable sipo dust is scaring me."

Don't use it. Use African mahogany. Cheap, available, and nicer to work with.

Edit: going back through the thread I see you have most of the neck completed - suit up and carry on! gaah
Author:  Jules [ Sat Jun 23, 2018 11:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
Clay S. wrote:
Use African mahogany. Cheap, available, and nicer to work with.

It used to be cheap and available, until I moved to Florida. There is one place about an hour from here that carries it but the prices are through the roof. An hour in the other direction is a place where the prices are reasonable but the selection is limited. That's where I picked up the sipo. I had never even heard of it before but I wanted something to use as edging for our kitchen counters. It worked out great there and I had no issues physically. That's why I'm beginning to think it's the CA that's the real problem.
Author:  Jules [ Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:09 am ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
Things are moving along without incident, just slowly.

Checked the alignment with bridge in place
Image

Then did the fretboard glue up
Image

Chose abalone dots. They go well with the sound hole ring
Image

Everything has been sealed with shellac (except under the fretboard and bridge). But I'm thinking I'll need to make a bridge from either cocobolo to match the fretboard or sipo to match the sides and back.
Image
Author:  SnowManSnow [ Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
I wouldn’t make a bridge out of sipo. That’s just me, but most bridges are made of denser woods. The mass and such matters (someone with more technical knowledge can shed light on that). I’m not sure about coco either....


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Author:  SnowManSnow [ Wed Jul 04, 2018 8:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
The build is looking very good btw. So much better than my first build :) wtg !


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Author:  Jules [ Wed Jul 04, 2018 10:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
SnowManSnow wrote:
I wouldn’t make a bridge out of sipo. That’s just me, but most bridges are made of denser woods. The mass and such matters (someone with more technical knowledge can shed light on that). I’m not sure about coco either....


FWIW, the sipo I have is pretty dense but I still have the same concerns as you. Same with cocobolo. Maybe I can lighten the IR bridge with some dye.
Author:  Jules [ Wed Jul 04, 2018 12:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
I stripped the finish off the rosewood bridge and did some orange dye then a coat of shellac
Image

Still not a perfect match but that may not be possible.
Author:  Joe Beaver [ Wed Jul 04, 2018 2:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
It looks good to me. Coco is a lot like BRW, it will darken in time, so will the IRW bridge. I am not familiar with the side wood on this beauty.
Author:  Jules [ Wed Jul 04, 2018 9:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
Joe Beaver wrote:
I am not familiar with the side wood on this beauty.

I wasn't either until I ran into a deal on sipo - $4/bd ft. I threw two more planks into the Jeep cuz you never know. And then came the itch to build an acoustic.

It's not bad looking but kinda hard on tooling. I find I'm sharpening plane irons more with this stuff. Bending was initially a nightmare but this was my first try at side bending. It took me a while but once I learned not to soak it and be patient, bending wasn't so bad. Next time I'm going to give ammonia a try on the sipo. Ammonia worked so well on quilted maple I'm compelled to give it a shot on side bending.
Author:  Jules [ Thu Jul 12, 2018 1:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
Well, here we are. Only the nut to make and bridge to set.
Image

The nut won't be an issue but gluing that bridge will take some courage.
Author:  SnowManSnow [ Sun Jul 22, 2018 6:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: First Acoustic Build - Martin OM Style
Jules wrote:
Well, here we are. Only the nut to make and bridge to set.
Image

The nut won't be an issue but gluing that bridge will take some courage.


Looking good!
You may have already done it, but I try to locate that bridge with locating pins as I glue it to keep it in the right place:)
You’ll be happy with how it turns out and itching to start again


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