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 Post subject: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 12:47 pm 
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Walnut
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First name: David
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What’s the latest thinking on best glue and practices for torrefied red spruce and braces? Also wondering what thickness folks are using as a starting point for their torrefied tops? Seems like torrefied has been around long enough that there’s a bunch of experience with it out there.
Thanks,
David


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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 1:50 pm 
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Koa
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I don't see why we'd glue it any differently. It's not like baking a piece of wood turns it into another species that's somehow resistant to gluing.


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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:10 pm 
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Walnut
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I’ve read various reports that torrefied wood is more demanding to glue since the cellular structure has been changed. Seems like many early adopters had glue failures.


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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:13 pm 
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I was worried about that also. Torrified wood is supposed to act like old, seasoned wood. I do know that the pine and fir in 100 year old houses is quite hard, even to the point to where driving a nail into it can be difficult.

But, I have just finished three torrified sitka tops from StewMac with no problems. I just made sure I had freshly prepared joints and I glued with titebond as usual. Time will tell.

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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 3:12 pm 
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Koa
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State: Texas
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dscheckman wrote:
I’ve read various reports that torrefied wood is more demanding to glue since the cellular structure has been changed. Seems like many early adopters had glue failures.


Either they don't know how to get good glue joints or they're just pissing on torrefaction because it's something they haven't used before. Alot of the time things like this are a self fulfilling prophecy.

Good woodworking practice eliminates alot of the supposed "issues" that folks seem to seek out on the internet.


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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 5:31 pm 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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Fish Glue.

Mike

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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:00 pm 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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the only thing I do differently is to allow a bit more clamping time. Been using this for years and really like it.

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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:20 pm 
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Cocobolo
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I use Old Brown Glue for both the center joint and to glue the braces on the torrefied tops I've done.

I don't even heat it up any more. I use it straight out of the bottle. I let it dry overnight and then it's good to go.



These users thanked the author DanSavage for the post: DanKirkland (Sun Jul 29, 2018 6:59 pm)
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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 10:18 am 
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Torrefied wood does not absorb moisure as readily. This is the reason it is more stable. Since wood glues cure when the water in the glue is absorbed into the wood, it makes sense to allow more clamping time when gluing torrefied wood.
I have no experience with using torrefied wood, but I just got 100 red spruce tops back from the kiln. It is lighter and stiffer.

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These users thanked the author John Arnold for the post: Pmaj7 (Tue Aug 07, 2018 11:50 pm)
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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 10:24 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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As mentioned, just clamp it longer. Titebond and hide glue both work well. 25+ torrefied top guitars without a problem...touch wood.



These users thanked the author meddlingfool for the post: Pmaj7 (Tue Aug 07, 2018 11:50 pm)
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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:23 am 
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Koa
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We baked our sole bottle of Titebond at 375 degrees (after filling the air space with a nitrogen/argon mix) for 96 hours...we now have torrified wood glue to use with our torrified brace and top wood.

Problem solved!

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These users thanked the author Woodie G for the post (total 6): ernie (Wed Aug 08, 2018 7:22 am) • Pmaj7 (Tue Aug 07, 2018 11:51 pm) • Bri (Tue Aug 07, 2018 10:31 pm) • Steve Marcq (Fri Aug 03, 2018 2:27 pm) • DannyV (Thu Aug 02, 2018 11:14 am) • bftobin (Wed Aug 01, 2018 12:12 pm)
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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:29 pm 
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laughing6-hehe - Good one Woodie!

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The name catgut is confusing. There are two explanations for the mix up.

Catgut is an abbreviation of the word cattle gut. Gut strings are made from sheep or goat intestines, in the past even from horse, mule or donkey intestines.

Otherwise it could be from the word kitgut or kitstring. Kit meant fiddle, not kitten.


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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:14 pm 
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Cocobolo
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Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 12:54 pm
Posts: 132
Location: Trabuco Canyon, CA
First name: Dan
Last Name: Savage
City: Trabuco Canyon
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Country: USA
John Arnold wrote:
Torrefied wood does not absorb moisure as readily. This is the reason it is more stable. Since wood glues cure when the water in the glue is absorbed into the wood, it makes sense to allow more clamping time when gluing torrefied wood.
I have no experience with using torrefied wood, but I just got 100 red spruce tops back from the kiln. It is lighter and stiffer.


To clarify the concepts about torrefied wood and moisture, torrefied wood does not absorb *atmospheric* moisture as readily.

If you wipe a piece of torrefied wood with a damp rag, it will still get wet and the moisture will still soak into the wood, but it won't warp the wood.


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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:51 pm 
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Mahogany
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My mentor taught me that Fish Glue was best for torrified tops... it’s what I use


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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 Post subject: Re: Torrified wood glue
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2018 4:02 pm 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:20 am
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"We baked our sole bottle of Titebond at 375 degrees (after filling the air space with a nitrogen/argon mix) for 96 hours...we now have torrified wood glue to use with our torrified brace and top wood.

Problem solved!"

That sounds half baked!....... you should have done it for 192 hours......


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