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 Post subject: Build started
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 10:03 am 
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Koa
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I'm going to try to keep everything in this thread until completion.

Its starting to look like a guitar now and I found bending rosewood to be very easy. Of course I did a lot better on the second side.
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20180909_103727-600x600.jpeg


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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."



These users thanked the author banjopicks for the post: Michaeldc (Sun Sep 09, 2018 10:21 am)
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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 10:51 am 
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Good to see you're using a pipe to bend. Learning the use of one is essential to the craft.


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 10:59 am 
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Thanks. Yeah I have experience with mandolin sides. These are actually easier due to the straight grained rosewood

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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 5:35 am 
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Mistake 1. Cut the board for the blocks in the wrong direction. Oh well that's what glue is for.

I can't tell you how much I love this workmate I got at a yardsale. I don't know how I got along without it one all these years. I use it as a clamp as in the photo. I use it for planing a true edge before running through the tablesaw. Even face planing on these blocks works very well.

Mistake 2. I was staring at my plan and something along the side caught my eye. Sure enough there is a template for cutting the sides. This why I don't build 2 instruments at once, at least in the beginning.
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20180910_062301-600x600.jpeg


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Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 6:48 am 
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This mornings work. I found I need to replace or stiffen the throat plate on my tablesaw. I meant to leave some extra stock on the miters but ended up taking a little more than I wanted because of the dip. Not a big problem but something to watch on the next one.
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_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:05 am 
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I watched this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4wS73H78EE&t=1218s this morning before going into the shop. I want to try it. I love the idea that I'm in charge of the colors and my guitar will stand out from the pack if I do this. Even though it's my first guitar, it isn't my first instrument and I believe the end result will be playable, sound good enough and look beautiful. I'm in no hurry to complete it.

_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2018 7:58 am 
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Got my linings done finally. I had to abort the tablesaw for cutting the kerfs. I just made a mess so I went back to my old way on the recently acquired bandsaw. Done and moving on.

Attachment:
Linings.jpg

Attachment:
Linings Jig.jpg


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_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."



These users thanked the author banjopicks for the post: Anthony Davis (Thu Aug 01, 2019 7:43 pm)
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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2018 10:04 am 
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I have a few minutes so I thought I would explain the issue I had with the tablesaw method. I cut all my cut 1/4" strips and beveled them on the TS, that was fine. Then I double stick taped them to a carrier board and flipped it over and ran it through the TS with a thin kerf blade. I checked the first few cuts and everything looked great so I continued. Then I noticed some loose pieces sticking out. Oh crap. Some of the strips didn't stay tight to the board for some reason and I ended up with a bunch tentalones. Rather than try and solve the problem, I moved over to what I know works. I'm loving my new used BS.

With this done, I can now trim my sides, glue in the end blocks and linings. I'm still waiting for John Hall to get some sandpaper for my dish I bought from him. Hopefully he'll get it in before I need it. While I'm waiting, I can start building a go-bar deck.

_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."



These users thanked the author banjopicks for the post: violinvic (Tue Sep 25, 2018 9:12 pm)
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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2018 8:06 am 
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Koa
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I followed John Halls video for gluing these on. Thank you John. Had it not been for that, I would have glued them on in the mold and probably not have gotten a good glue up. I know the blocks are shaped perfect to the plan, I'm not so sure about my mold.

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42428999_988233614681007_2471854889752330240_n.jpg


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_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 7:10 am 
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Koa
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I'm getting to the part where I install the linings. Before I do that I need to add the side reinforcement. The plan calls for cloth tape, which I don't have or spruce. Which is preferred?

_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."



These users thanked the author banjopicks for the post: Anthony Davis (Thu Aug 01, 2019 8:12 pm)
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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 8:10 am 
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Koa
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First name: Brad
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For the side struts (side braces), you can just use strips of whatever material you made the kerfed linings out of. There is some discussion about where to place the struts, I do things differently (solid linings) but what I've seen discussed here, placing the brace so that it goes just between the lining is often done, but creates the potential for a stress point at the intersection of the lining and the brace. So some folks will either notch out one kerf and run the brace the full side width or at least let the brace into the lining a little bit.


FWIW, before I switched to solid lining I put the braces just between the linings.


Here is some good past discussion on the topic:

viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=50109
viewtopic.php?f=10101&t=50876

Brad

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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 8:25 am 
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Koa
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banjopicks wrote:
Had it not been for that, I would have glued them on in the mold and probably not have gotten a good glue up.


A technique which allows the use of the mold for this task is shown. Gluing up in the mold (with mold on bench blocked up to center on sides) guarantees a square rim. Two simple cauls (scraps of 3mm ply or 1/8" spruce) keep the portion of the sides above and below the mold tight to the blocks for a good joint. Besides ensuring the blocks are square, the mold centerline helps with centering the blocks.

A single Bessey Tradesman 6" ($20) on the centerline of the block and centered on the mold and 4 of the smaller 4" ($5 each) for the cauls do the job.

Attachment:
Caul-for-Tail-Block-Detail-.jpg


Cotton/poly bias tape is available at Walmart in the notions section...cut to 11/16" width and install. A light sanding will prep the area for the linings and avoid the stress risers that can occur if wooden side supports are butted to linings. Darker brown or seal colored tapes look nice on both darker and lighter sides, with the medium brown on darker BRW sides a nice effect. We've used both red and green tapes as well. Iron on 'polyester' setting prior to cutting...we like using a roller cutter, but a sharp razor blade works as well. Here's the link to the correct tape at Walmart:

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Extra-Wide-Double-Fold-Bias-Tape/17330819

The mocha color on curly ash is a nice contrast.

Attachment:
000C_12_ash_redwood.jpg


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 10:04 am 
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That looks like a better way to clamp. Saving it for #2.
The seal brown tape is out of stock on-line. I'm going to stop in and see what they have on the shelf.

"Iron on polyester setting? You need to iron it on?

_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Wed Sep 26, 2018 12:03 pm 
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Koa
Koa

Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:33 am
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First name: Willard
Last Name: Guthrie
City: Cumberland
State: Maryland 21502
Zip/Postal Code: 21502
Country: United State
Focus: Repair
Status: Semi-pro
Quote:
Iron on 'polyester' setting prior to cutting...we like using a roller cutter, but a sharp razor blade works as well.


Goodness...that sentence can be read a few different ways! To elaborate...the bias tape will be wrinkled and creased out of the package...ironing the tape flattens the wrinkles and creases so that the process of cutting to length and width proceeds with fewer issues. There are some very simple jigs which can be used to make consistent-width tapes in bias material...let me know and I can post a few shots with technique.

Nearly any fabric store should have Wright's single or double-width bias tape in a variety of colors. When I used to make many of my daughter's outfits (I doubt they would tolerate it now!), most of the supplies came from local notions and fabric shops, but now I would likely try JoAnn's or possibly G Street in Rockville MD, JoAnn's online, or Amazon. If you check your local area for fabric stores, I am certain one of them will carry a good selection of bias tapes, as the product is used in a number of applications in fabric arts. Resist the urge to use satin ribbon (usually made from nylon or the like) despite what recommendations might be made by the shopkeepers...the cotton/poly blend bias tape is the right combination of strength and ability to glue well to the substrate.

On a related topic, there was a major guitar company that thought a peel'n'stick (first cousin to iron-on) side tape was a good idea...I've enjoyed peeling those dead or dying side tapes off of several instruments.

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Watch what people are cynical about, and one can often discover what they lack.
– General George S. Patton Jr.


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 7:59 am 
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Started jointing things today. I have 2 tops and backs to do. I'll be using HHG and stretched tape unless someone has a better idea. These came pre-shaped from Martin so there's no easy way to apply pressure. I got a beautiful glue line from my Stanley #6.

I've had this wood for a few years and I'm finally getting to build with it. It's Martin seconds and I think it's great for my first guitars. The price is right and I'm more concerned with getting the rosewood tone rather than perfectly straight grain lines. I checked the join before planing and honestly, it didn't need any planing except to freshen up the glue line. I'll do it again right before I glue it. It even has brace lines drawn on it. What's better than that? I don't know if I'll have to do anything with the thickness but I'll check it after I glue it.

Attachment:
JointingTheBack.jpg


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_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:23 am 
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Had a great morning in the shop. I got 2 back and top sets glued up. I started out jointing with my Stanley #6 getting pretty good results but not perfect. I have this really expensive LV LA Jack sitting on the shelf and I realized that it was going to waste and this is the perfect job for it. The joints were slightly better and I didn't have to do any tweaking with sandpaper.
Attachment:
LV_LA_JACK.jpg


I didn't use any clamps, just tightly pulled ordinary masking tape. Seemed to do the job. Oh yeah, hot hide glue was the glue of the day.
Attachment:
TopPrepForGlue.jpg

Attachment:
GluedSets.jpg



I also got to try out my radius sanding dish. Makes the job of shaping the rims a piece of cake. Crap, now I want cake.

Attachment:
SandingDish.jpg


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_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:52 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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Location: The Woodlands, Texas
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How thick are your plates?


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 9:06 am 
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Koa
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I don't remember, I'll check when I get home. The top plates that I got from RC Tonewoods look to be over an 1/8th of an inch, best guess and the back plates fro Martin, approximately .1". I have a pretty good eye, but I'll check later.

I have back strips and 1 rosette set coming from StewMac. I bought the 1 year of free shipping cause I know I'm going to be buying stuff as needed.

_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 4:14 am 
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Koa
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Well so much for my eye. The top measures .150" and the back .125".

_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 10:03 am 
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Brazilian Rosewood
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Location: The Woodlands, Texas
First name: Barry
Last Name: Daniels
Hope you are planning on reducing the thickness of the plates some.


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 10:24 am 
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Koa
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Yeah, I over did it on my first one. I had more confidence in my planing skills than I should have. I got it down to .07 in the seam. I'll be putting this aside for something else.

I have a friend who owns a thickness sander. I'll do the rest at his house.Image

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_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 11:02 am 
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This is why it is wise to use decent quality, but not expensive, wood on the first few guitars. The first few guitars are the ones where you make the mistakes that help you learn the best lessons. They are a pain in the arse, but those mistakes are your best friends in the long run. You don't want to meet those friend using really expensive wood.


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Sat Sep 29, 2018 12:45 pm 
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Yeah I'm not out much on that top.

Sent from my SM-G935V using Tapatalk

_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:07 am 
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Koa
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First I had to make a template from 1/8" hardboard I saved from my wife's new canopy we recently bought. I have plenty more for other templates.

Attachment:
necktemplate.jpg


Next I traced the new template onto my mahogany and cut it to approximate length. Tomorrow I hope to go to the bandsaw with them. I got 4 necks out of this piece of 4X4 mahogany. That's about $10 per neck. I need to add a small piece to the heel to finish it. I got this piece from up the street at Koszelas Lumber. I think it's meant to be a deck post or something but the grain looks mostly nice and straight and pretty close to quarter sawn the way I laid therm out I will now have mahogany scraps to build other things with.

Attachment:
neck layout.jpg


I'll get the expensive stuff if I find this to be a problem and someone wants to buy a guitar. I'll probably keep the first and second or give one to my daughter or grandson.


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_________________
Hutch

Get the heck off the couch and go build a guitar!!!!
That's a reminder for me.

"Alan Carruth, IMO the 12-fret 000 or 14 fret OM size (15" wide lower bout) is god's size for the steel string guitar, especially for fingerstyle. I would also try to get away from scalloped bracing and lean toward 'straight' or 'tapered' bracing. Scalloped emphasizes bass and 'punch', where straight bracing, and especially 'tapered' (sometimes called 'parabolic') leans more toward treble and sustain."


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 Post subject: Re: Build started
PostPosted: Fri Oct 12, 2018 10:16 pm 
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Koa
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Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 877
2 things ... maybe you addressed them already, and I just missed it.

On neck wood. It’s no biggie to use a scarf joint and stacked heel. It’s normally a LOT cheaper.

2: make sure when you joint that you are placing the 2 sides together and candle lighting it. There should be no light seepage on the joint. Then glue up:)
I use the tape method too, and it works just fine:)
Glad you’re enjoying the process !


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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