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 Post subject: Re: Noob
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 4:10 pm 
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Cocobolo
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Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2006 6:44 pm
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Location: Australia
First name: Allen
Last Name: McFarlen
City: Mt. Sheridan
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I'll add a huge thumnbs up for Fusion360. The Youtube material available is absoolutely amazing and is all you would likely need to get you though the learning curve, but if not just ask on the Autodesk forum and someone or many will walk you through.

And yes, an acoustic neck would have to be one of the most complicated things to you will ever model. Don't make it your first project.

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 Post subject: Re: Noob
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 4:55 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 1:45 pm
Posts: 575
First name: Michael
City: Port Townsend
State: WA
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DarrenFiggs wrote:
Michaeldc wrote:
DarrenFiggs wrote:
Michaeldc, what is it you don't like about the CRCPRO4848? Gaswdust recommended the company up above, and I've turned my attention away from the X-carve in favor of the machines made by CNCRP.


Actually I really like my machine. There are just machines out there that are stiffer and more accurate these days. It does do everything I ask it to though. I'd have a look at their Benchtop Pro http://www.cncrouterparts.com/benchtop- ... p-462.html . Also, their plug-n-play systems are worth every penny. Nema-23 steppers are plenty strong enough for what you are gonna be doing. That's what I have on my bigger machine and they work great!

M


The stiffer and more accurate machines, are they in the same price range as the CNCRP's?


A friend of mine has an Axiom pro 6. You could check those out. I think it's a welded steel machine. I know he had some trouble with it early on. The spindle was running backwards, the water pump leaked, and I think tech support was somewhat underwhelming. Andy Birko uses Xzero machines though I'm pretty sure Xzero is toast. If I was to buy another machine it'd be a 24"X 36" CRP Benchtop Pro with their plug and play gear. You are probably looking at $8k for one of those with Vcarve pro 9 and Mack3


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 Post subject: Re: Noob
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 5:43 pm 
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Cocobolo
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Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
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Michaeldc wrote:
SnowManSnow wrote:
rlrhett wrote:
[quote="Gasawdust"]Rlrhett,
Just curious if you are still using your first CNC or did you buy your second machine first, as I have heard others suggest.


I'm on my third. And if I was to do it again, I think I would have started with an even smaller and cheaper one first to learn on. I wanted one right off the bat big enough to carve a 21"x17" arch top. Plain stupid.

I completely understand both sides of that
I don’t think anyone has asked strait up, but what are your thoughts on an x carve unit?
The HUGE downside I’ve seen that is obvious is that I THINK the z axis only travels 3”...is that correct ??


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Actually it says it's got 65mm or 2.55" of Z. You'd be able to do fretboard slots, inlay, and outside profiles on a pre radiused board. You'd likely be able to do head stocks as long as the router bit can reach out over the front edge of the table by 1-1/2" or better. Rosettes would be no problem. You are going to have to go very slowly to get decent resolution. The frame extrusions are tiny.... What is it using for software. Can you download a demo copy and play with it?

Edit... Bridges would also be possible[/quote]
So basically to do a neck you’d set up the profile and radius for the back of it and have to do a scarf and stacked heel or else you’d need considerably more than 2.55” of z (I’m assuming z is vertical travel)


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 Post subject: Re: Noob
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 5:59 pm 
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Cocobolo
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Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
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I just downloaded fusion360 (wife happens to be an educator) :)


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 Post subject: Re: Noob
PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:08 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:17 pm
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City: Escondido
State: CA
Zip/Postal Code: 92029
Country: USA
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Status: Semi-pro
I think planning on using the CNC to carve a neck AND THEN glueing a heel stack and scarf jointed headstock is not practical. Not impossible, but probably more complicated and time consuming than just carving the neck by hand.


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These users thanked the author rlrhett for the post: SnowManSnow (Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:45 pm)
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 Post subject: Re: Noob
PostPosted: Sat Jul 21, 2018 8:12 pm 
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Michael, that Benchtop Pro, is the 7" - 9.3" Z-axis going to be enough to do an acoustic neck?


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 Post subject: Re: Noob
PostPosted: Sun Jul 22, 2018 7:13 am 
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Koa
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Joined: Sun Jun 22, 2014 1:45 pm
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First name: Michael
City: Port Townsend
State: WA
Focus: Build
DarrenFiggs wrote:
Michael, that Benchtop Pro, is the 7" - 9.3" Z-axis going to be enough to do an acoustic neck?


My friend with the Axiom machine is doing acoustic necks on it and it's got a 6" X. I know it's at its absolute limit to do so. You could PM Andy Birko and ask what his machines have for Z.


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 Post subject: Re: Noob
PostPosted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:09 am 
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Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2008 6:59 am
Posts: 1918
Location: Rochester Michigan
Just saw this thread and basically agree with everything rlrhett said.

As to making acoustic necks on the machine - that's probably one of the most difficult to process items with the CNC. Not so much the actual cutting, but drawing the thing so it looks nice once it's cut is the challenge. Lots of sweeping blends and so forth.

Z-axis travel is tricky to get your head around so what I did was draw up a simple sketch in CAD to get a hold of what's going on. Perhaps a good project to draw up in Fusion 360 to figure out the answer yourself and learn a bit while you go along.

My machines have a bit over 7" of Z travel and 5.5" under the gantry. A rule of thumb is that you need roughly double the travel of the tallest item you want to machine. If you want a 4" tall heel, you'll need roughly 8" of travel to clear the part when machining. The good thing about CNC is that clearance is clearance. On some steel parts I was making a few months ago I had .004" clearance between the shoulder of an end mill and the part and it's just fine (so long as nothing's moving). If your tool clears the heel by .010", you're fine and you'll always be fine so long as you don't botch some part of the setup or whatever (which happens a lot).

Once you have adequate Z travel, you now have to mount your spindle so that you can utilize all of it. In the early days of the Xzero, I saw a lot of photos of the machine with the Z axis bottom set below the gantry bottom which did nothing but eat up gantry clearance. I had to modify my Z axis so I could get all the clearance under the gantry that I could for taller parts. I even have one fixture that doesn't clear the gantry on one side, I have it set up so that I was able to exploit "design limitations" of the machine to make a fixture that's a few inches taller than the gantry.

But back to the most important part that rlrhett pointed out: If you can't draw it, you can't machine it. Guitars have a lot of 3D surfaces on them which are the most challenging to draw up. Start drawing some stuff in Fusion 360 or whatever package you think you may end up using and see if you can handle it. You can always outsource some of the more complicated stuff if you need to but be prepared to pay between $60 ~ $120/hour for design time.

Sorry for the randomness of the response but I'm feeling somewhat under the weather today. Good Luck!

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