Official Luthiers Forum!

first off i was wondering if anyone on here had ever used square aluminum rod as reinforcement in a bass neck instead of carbon fiber strips. i had some that is a 1/4 in sqaure and would offer a lot of support but i wasn't sure if it had any kind of negative qualities i should be aware of.

secondly what kinda action should i shoot for on a fretless bass? has anyone on here ever set on up before?

~Shad Peters

_________________
~shad peters

http://www.flickr.com/photos/petersinstruments/
http://petersinstruments.blogspot.com/
http://petersinstruments.com/

Square aluminum bar will weigh too much and will retain flex memory.

well actually aluminum is a very light material almost as light as carbon fiber, but when you consider that and aluminum bike frame compared to a carbon bike frame might have a difference of a pound at most between them on something as small as a support rod you wouldn't even be able to tell the difference.( i don't mean to sound snooty but i have done some research and also do a lot of work with aluminum and other metals) and as far as the memory of the metal its not much different than steel it just depends on the grade of the metal, but unless i build an incredibly horrible instrument the neck shouldn't ever bend so much that the aluminum doesn't have the memory to snap back (they wouldnt make aircraft from it otherwise). i mean like i said correct me if im just totally off base or something, but I'm fairly confident in its ability to strengthen the neck i am mostly worried if it would have bad tone qualities or something of that nature.

shad peters

_________________
~shad peters

http://www.flickr.com/photos/petersinstruments/
http://petersinstruments.blogspot.com/
http://petersinstruments.com/

Warmoth uses steel reinforcement bars in their bass neck, it works but it does weight a bit more, but not enough to throw the bass off balance unless you use very light body wood.

_________________
Cat-gut strings are made from kitten guts, stretched out to near breaking point and then hardened with grue saliva. As a result these give a feeling of Pain and anguish whenever played, and often end up playing themselves backwards as part of satanic rituals.

Typhoon Guitars
http://www.typhoon-guitars.com

I just started using 3/32 x 0.25" steel reinforcement rods in my necks and love the results. The neck is bright and alive everywhere, and is consistently stiff. I use a heavy cutaway design that creates a torsional loading on the neck. Without heavy reinforcement, it is a bear to set up...

Some of the big names, like Pedulla use steel in there necks as well, after trying CF and Aluminum, they settled on steel because it seemed to be the most consistent in strength and energy transmission.

Stephen

_________________
www.ziegenfussguitars.com

The benefit of steel is that they're cheap, and not such a pain to work with like CF. I could buy steel rods from any shop and use that instead of paying inflated prices plus shipping and tax.

_________________
Cat-gut strings are made from kitten guts, stretched out to near breaking point and then hardened with grue saliva. As a result these give a feeling of Pain and anguish whenever played, and often end up playing themselves backwards as part of satanic rituals.

Typhoon Guitars
http://www.typhoon-guitars.com

Aluminum is not nearly as stiff in cross section as steel or carbon fiber, but it is as stiff pound for pound (as steel). Essentially, you'll have to use a piece of aluminum 3x as wide (and of equal height) to get the same stiffness (and mass) as a piece of steel. When considering the shape of a guitar neck in cross-section, you can fit a much taller (stiffer) piece of steel in there comfortably than an equivalent piece of aluminum, and you'll displace less wood.

_________________
Bob Garrish
Former Canonized Purveyor of Fine CNC Luthier Services

You can get titanium from KTS and it costs less than CF usually.

Which KTS is that? I only see bridge parts on their site.

Regarding alu, I would opt for 1/4 x 3/8" or even 1/2" if it will fit in your neck. A 1/4" rod layed just under the fingerboard would be pretty close to the neutral axis so would not likely do much good.

Hi Sheldon, You had the correct site but you have to contact them to specify size. They also make titanium truss rods as well. Look under custom shop on the web site.
Hope that helps

thanks everyone your comments were all really helpful

_________________
~shad peters

http://www.flickr.com/photos/petersinstruments/
http://petersinstruments.blogspot.com/
http://petersinstruments.com/

Thanks Brett, I'm going to give some a try.

The difference between aluminum and carbon fiber is that the carbon fiber has some spring back. It is rigid but if it is bent in a neck it doesn't retain that bend like aluminum can. Steel also has spring back ability to a point. A lot more then aluminum.