Official Luthiers Forum!

Owned and operated by Lance Kragenbrink
It is currently Thu Mar 28, 2024 3:42 am


All times are UTC - 5 hours


Forum rules


Be nice, no cussin and enjoy!




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 39 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:51 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1700
I need to remove kerfing so I can redo the job correctly. Any advise on doing this or do I just take a chisel and start working ?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 5:59 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2005 4:02 am
Posts: 3227
Location: The Woodlands, Texas
First name: Barry
Last Name: Daniels
What kind of glue did you use and when was the original kerfing installed?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 6:24 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1700
A few weeks ago . Fish glue


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 8:47 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:15 pm
Posts: 7219
First name: Ed
Last Name: Bond
City: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
How does fish glue undo?

I need to do that from time to time, I use a clothes iron from the outside and try to get the pallet knife in there, mindful not to attempt to much twisting of the knife to remove it. In other words, don't try to use the knife as a lever, you can blow your sides if not careful..



These users thanked the author meddlingfool for the post: James Orr (Sat Jul 13, 2019 11:20 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 3:43 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:44 am
Posts: 5397
First name: colin
Last Name: north
Country: Scotland.
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
I thought some moisture with the heart would be efficacious.

_________________
The name catgut is confusing. There are two explanations for the mix up.

Catgut is an abbreviation of the word cattle gut. Gut strings are made from sheep or goat intestines, in the past even from horse, mule or donkey intestines.

Otherwise it could be from the word kitgut or kitstring. Kit meant fiddle, not kitten.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 10:29 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:20 am
Posts: 5924
"I thought some moisture with the heart would be efficacious."

Really it's nothing to cry your heart out over! pizza


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 11:39 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:44 am
Posts: 5397
First name: colin
Last Name: north
Country: Scotland.
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
gaah I think I meant heat laughing6-hehe

_________________
The name catgut is confusing. There are two explanations for the mix up.

Catgut is an abbreviation of the word cattle gut. Gut strings are made from sheep or goat intestines, in the past even from horse, mule or donkey intestines.

Otherwise it could be from the word kitgut or kitstring. Kit meant fiddle, not kitten.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 12:07 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member

Joined: Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:52 pm
Posts: 2953
First name: Don
Last Name: Parker
City: Charleston
State: West Virginia
Zip/Postal Code: 25314
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
I like the phrase “water with the heart” better. Agua con corazon.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 14, 2019 4:37 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1700
I got most of it off w a sharp brace carving chisel ... sandpaper will handle the rest.

Ed, moisture w fish glue


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 1:41 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1700
When I finish the rekerf.... do I simply plane it down flush to the sides or do I need to go back to the radius dishes?
B


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 2:51 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:37 am
Posts: 4777
SnowManSnow wrote:
When I finish the rekerf.... do I simply plane it down flush to the sides or do I need to go back to the radius dishes?
B


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


I’d chalk the kerf or make witness lines with a pencil, then re-sand. It shouldn’t take too long. You’ll want the new material to be properly radiused. :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jul 19, 2019 5:43 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:15 pm
Posts: 7219
First name: Ed
Last Name: Bond
City: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
Back to the dishpit with ya!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2019 1:47 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:35 pm
Posts: 2951
Location: United States
First name: Joe
Last Name: Beaver
City: Lake Forest
State: California
Focus: Build
Yes, Ed is so right, back to the dishpit ya be.

_________________
Joe Beaver
Maker of Sawdust


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2019 4:24 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:17 pm
Posts: 1161
City: Escondido
State: CA
Zip/Postal Code: 92029
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
So I read and re-read the last two post. I couldn’t understand why you guys were being so harsh and vulgar. It turns out I may have been transposing the sh/p. :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 5:30 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:44 am
Posts: 5397
First name: colin
Last Name: north
Country: Scotland.
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
rlrhett wrote:
So I read and re-read the last two post. I couldn’t understand why you guys were being so harsh and vulgar. It turns out I may have been transposing the sh/p. :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

laughing6-hehe Don't think harsh and vulgar at all! Think radius dish slave pit gaah again!

_________________
The name catgut is confusing. There are two explanations for the mix up.

Catgut is an abbreviation of the word cattle gut. Gut strings are made from sheep or goat intestines, in the past even from horse, mule or donkey intestines.

Otherwise it could be from the word kitgut or kitstring. Kit meant fiddle, not kitten.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 5:19 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1700
Colin North wrote:
rlrhett wrote:
So I read and re-read the last two post. I couldn’t understand why you guys were being so harsh and vulgar. It turns out I may have been transposing the sh/p. :)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

laughing6-hehe Don't think harsh and vulgar at all! Think radius dish slave pit gaah again!

Arrrrrgg! To the dishpit!!!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 10:12 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:33 am
Posts: 1831
First name: Willard
Last Name: Guthrie
City: Cumberland
State: Maryland 21502
Zip/Postal Code: 21502
Country: United State
Focus: Repair
Status: Semi-pro
So relining the body with kerfed lining...OK. it needs to go in slightly proud (1/32" is perfect) and re-radiused using the same approach taken the first time.

_________________
We have become a civilization that elevates idiots, prostitutes, and clowns. Am I still to defend it? Yes, for its principles. Yes, for what it was. Yes, for what it still may be.

-Mark Helprin, The Oceans and the Stars: A Sea Story, A War Story, A Love Story (A Novel)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 7:50 am 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1700
Woodie G wrote:
So relining the body with kerfed lining...OK. it needs to go in slightly proud (1/32" is perfect) and re-radiused using the same approach taken the first time.

I DID get it re-dished :) it was, though a challenge as the back is glued on already... I was going to take a chance on the thinned lining, but decided to rekerf it instead of wondering if the top would fly off...

So what I had to do was lay the rim w the mold down upside down on the dish and do my best to keep even pressure as I rotated it around... the mold was heavy enough to add weight so It didn’t take forever and I did get the radius reapplied as well as taken out of the upper bout:)

Image

Ready for the ol top:)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:53 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:44 am
Posts: 5397
First name: colin
Last Name: north
Country: Scotland.
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
That's better!

_________________
The name catgut is confusing. There are two explanations for the mix up.

Catgut is an abbreviation of the word cattle gut. Gut strings are made from sheep or goat intestines, in the past even from horse, mule or donkey intestines.

Otherwise it could be from the word kitgut or kitstring. Kit meant fiddle, not kitten.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:57 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:15 pm
Posts: 7219
First name: Ed
Last Name: Bond
City: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
That's how I do all mine. Move the frame, not the dish. But I had my dish custom made to about 2"...

Not sure how I feel about that gap under the neck block...



These users thanked the author meddlingfool for the post: SnowManSnow (Wed Jul 24, 2019 10:01 am)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 10:04 am 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1700
meddlingfool wrote:
That's how I do all mine. Move the frame, not the dish. But I had my dish custom made to about 2"...

Not sure how I feel about that gap under the neck block...

Well the gap only proceeds up to the kerfing. There is a strip around the top that is the same width as the rest of the kerfing. It’s the same kind of thing you can see on the tail block at the bottom where the top will go. I don’t see a lot of tension there, definitely not more than on the top at the tail block, so I figured why not free that are up to move.

Now, all that said, I’m just playing compared to
the things you do and if there’s a reason NOT to do that I’d happily listen to it and make appropriate adjustments next time.
Thanks Ed


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 10:12 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2009 7:52 am
Posts: 4524
First name: Big
Last Name: Jim
State: Deep in the heart of Bluegrass
Country: usa
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
doncaparker wrote:
I like the phrase “water with the heart” better. Agua con corazon.


es bein mi amigo [:Y:]

_________________
The Shallower the depth of the stream , The Louder the Babble !
The Taking Of Offense Is the Life Course Of The Stupid One !
Wanna Leave a Better Planet for our Kids? How about Working on BETTER KIDS for our Planet !
Forgiveness is the ability to accept an apology that you will probably NEVER GET
The truth will set you free , But FIRST, it will probably Piss you Off !
Creativity is allowing yourself to make Mistakes, Art is knowing which ones to Keep !
The Saddest thing anyone can do , is push a Loyal Person to the point that they Dont Care Anymore
Never met a STRONG person who had an EASY past !
http://wiksnwudwerks.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/groups/GatewayA ... rAssembly/


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 11:01 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:15 pm
Posts: 7219
First name: Ed
Last Name: Bond
City: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
Part of the reason guitars need neck resets is the forward rotation of the neck block, accompanied by the back flattening in that area. I’m not sure how much having the bottom of the block glued prevents this, but that’s why Spanish heels and c block style construction exists.

I’ve never done any deliberate experiments, but it’s my understanding that a gap like that is generally considered not a good idea by consensus.

If you look at chladni patterns of backs, there’s not a lot going on there anyway.

I’m sure with some digging you can find previous threads on it...



These users thanked the author meddlingfool for the post: SnowManSnow (Wed Jul 24, 2019 12:03 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 11:03 am 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:15 pm
Posts: 7219
First name: Ed
Last Name: Bond
City: Vancouver
Country: Canada
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
That being said, I do chamfer the tail block to lining width on the top...


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 12:04 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2017 8:43 am
Posts: 1700
meddlingfool wrote:
Part of the reason guitars need neck resets is the forward rotation of the neck block, accompanied by the back flattening in that area. I’m not sure how much having the bottom of the block glued prevents this, but that’s why Spanish heels and c block style construction exists.

I’ve never done any deliberate experiments, but it’s my understanding that a gap like that is generally considered not a good idea by consensus.

If you look at chladni patterns of backs, there’s not a lot going on there anyway.

I’m sure with some digging you can find previous threads on it...

Thanks Ed


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 39 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: banjopicks and 58 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
phpBB customization services by 2by2host.com