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 Post subject: Re: Saddle lowering...
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:54 pm 
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Mahogany
Mahogany

Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2015 6:50 pm
Posts: 63
First name: Tyson
Last Name: K
City: Stony plain
State: Ab
Zip/Postal Code: T7Z3A1
Country: Canada
Focus: Repair
Status: Amateur
I know it is low. All reviews of this guy say he under charges himself. And he must have a good amount of business because he just moved from a small shop in a very high end expensive part of town to a slightly lower end part of town but a bigger shop. And this guitar is with the money physical value, and twice that sentimental. So I'll probably bring it to the guy get a quote and go from there.


Tyson k


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 Post subject: Re: Saddle lowering...
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:04 pm 
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Contributing Member
Contributing Member

Joined: Fri Feb 29, 2008 2:41 pm
Posts: 312
Tyson.k wrote:
Well I did talk to a guy, he said that he charges on average 150-250 for a neck reset but that it depends on the guitar. This guy is very reputable from the looks of things.


Tyson k

That's really low, esp. for a Yamaha.

That bridge has already been shaved down.

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 Post subject: Re: Saddle lowering...
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2016 5:18 pm 
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Mahogany
Mahogany

Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2015 6:50 pm
Posts: 63
First name: Tyson
Last Name: K
City: Stony plain
State: Ab
Zip/Postal Code: T7Z3A1
Country: Canada
Focus: Repair
Status: Amateur
Ok so I've now used a 23" straight edge and it came out half a mm over the bridge. Now that I recall I think the guitar sat in storage with low string tension or no strings for a good while. So that will be why it's neck is in good nick. One other question, I put on new strings but the guitar now sound quite bad. No unbearable but very metal-y. Is that the type of strings? They have been on for a few days now so they are stretched out. Thoughts?


Tyson k


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 Post subject: Re: Saddle lowering...
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2016 6:44 pm 
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Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:20 am
Posts: 5968
If the action is where you want it ( from an earlier post you said you had shaved the saddle down before the pictures were taken), looking at your pictures I would say the neck looks fine - I wouldn't bother with a reset. How high are the strings off the soundboard at the bridge position? they should be somewhere between 5/16ths (min) to 9/16ths (max).
What type of strings did you buy? Generally bronze wound sound better than nickel wound for acoustic guitars. If you mention the maker and string type someone could better advise you.


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 Post subject: Re: Saddle lowering...
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2016 7:39 am 
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Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
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Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13631
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
Tyson it looks like your guitar may not need a reset and likely being stored with low tension did the trick.

As to what it sounds like....:) Everyday people bring us guitars that I'm old enough to remember them, the guitars.... when they were new.

From Teisco to Harmony from Dano to Silverstone the stuff that was clearly crap and junk when I was a kid is now seemingly coveted these days.... :roll: :D

We can fix em up and bring em back to life for sure and often do and that can be a great deal of fun too. But.... once all is said and done what you may have is a restored instrument from back in the day that may not have been all that even when new.....


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 Post subject: Re: Saddle lowering...
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2016 9:27 am 
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Mahogany
Mahogany

Joined: Wed Dec 16, 2015 6:50 pm
Posts: 63
First name: Tyson
Last Name: K
City: Stony plain
State: Ab
Zip/Postal Code: T7Z3A1
Country: Canada
Focus: Repair
Status: Amateur
Well that's not the case with this guitar Hesh. I have been playing the thing for years. These guitars were made to mimic a really nice Martin guitar (I cant remember the model) and some say they sound better. The quality of the guitar is not the best. But the tone is outstanding. The only guitar that I've played that matched it (which admittedly is not many) was a pretty nice guild guitar. But now with the new strings it sounds worse than it did 10 min before with an old set. Btw clay did you mean 32s? I can't imagine someone wanting 9/16 that pretty high!


Tyson k


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 Post subject: Re: Saddle lowering...
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2016 12:58 pm 
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Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2010 1:46 pm
Posts: 2171
First name: Freeman
Last Name: Keller
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
I'm going to jump in here with several comments - some based on the fact that I have an old Yamie which has gone thru similar repairs.

First, old Yamahas do have a bit of a cult following and many people, including myself, think they have a wonderful tone - but they aren't intended "to mimic a really nice Martin". They were cheaply built with laminated backs and usually tops and sold new in the $100 range. They were popular with us old folkies who couldn't afford a real Martin.

Second, looking at the straightedge/bridge picture I would say its close to needing a reset. However, my second way to evaluate is the "if the action is acceptable AND you have 1/8 of saddle sticking out....". It looks like that might be possible. For me "acceptable action" is around 0.070 high E and 0.090 low E at the 12th fret with as little relief as I can get (0.010 is my max) and frets in good condition (old Yamies have small frets). Tyson, you definition of "acceptable action" may vary - that's what I shoot for.

As far as resetting that neck - I don't have nearly the experience as Hesh or many others here but I have done a few conventional dovetail necks - I can get them apart and back together. I could not get my neck apart with steam and my home made press - it simply wouldn't budge so I did the saw it off and convert to bolt on trick. I know some people do reset these all the time - I've also heard of others having the same problem that I ran into.

The going rate that I see for resetting conventional dovetails is around $300 or 350. I don't know what someone would charge for trying it and failing (like I did). I don't know what someone would charge for converting it to bolt on - its at least as time consuming as steaming and resetting. Sawing the neck off also has the very real possibility of doing cosmetic damage.

Tyson, if you do consider shaving the bridge (I personally wouldn't) remember that a Yamaha bridge is a different shape that a standard Martin bridge. What this means is if you ever do decide to reset the neck you'll need to fabricate a new bridge to get it back up where it belongs.

So, bottom line. There are some people who seem to value old Yamaha's pretty highly - you sometimes see them on evil-bay for many hundreds of dollars - however basically they are cheap guitars. They would be ideal for a budding luthier to learn his resetting chops on but they are often hard to work on. I did all that work to mine because (1) I wanted to, and (2) I love that old guitar and wanted to make it a good playing instrument to take on road trips instead of my hand made ones or my Martins.

My two cents, obviously opinions will vary.



These users thanked the author Freeman for the post: kencierp (Thu Jan 28, 2016 1:43 pm)
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 Post subject: Re: Saddle lowering...
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2016 6:17 pm 
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Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 8:20 am
Posts: 5968
"Btw clay did you mean 32s? I can't imagine someone wanting 9/16 that pretty high!"


Hi Tyson,
No, I meant 9/16ths. We are talking about the distance from the- soundboard- to the strings. Generally I like this distance to be about 7/16ths inch. Some people prefer 1/2 inch. The distance can be as much as 9/16ths, but that is toward the outer limit. Conversely, the distance can be as little as 5/16ths and still not feel like you're scratching the soundboard. But again, that is the distance measured at the bridge from the soundboard to the strings.


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