Official Luthiers Forum!

Owned and operated by Lance Kragenbrink
It is currently Thu Dec 12, 2024 3:01 am


All times are UTC - 5 hours





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 46 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
PostPosted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 12:55 pm 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13417
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
Bump


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 2:21 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2011 1:32 pm
Posts: 3470
First name: Alex
Last Name: Kleon
City: Whitby
State: Ontario
Zip/Postal Code: L1N8X2
Country: Canada
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
I've just re read this for about the 5th time, Hesh, and it is slowly gaining access to my cluttered brain!
Thanks for the non-canine toot! I'll hopefully put it to practice this winter!

Alex

_________________
"Indecision is the key to flexibility" .... Bumper sticker



These users thanked the author Alex Kleon for the post: Hesh (Sat Dec 06, 2014 2:42 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Mar 04, 2015 3:51 pm 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 1:36 pm
Posts: 194
First name: Wes
Last Name: Young
City: NEWFIELD
State: NY
Zip/Postal Code: 14867
Country: United States
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
It's so easy!!! Thanks Hesh!!!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Mar 07, 2015 7:17 am 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo

Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 4:59 pm
Posts: 365
Location: Co cork Ireland
Country: Ireland
Focus: Build
Are you aiming for a specific bridge height with this method? I assume you want to end up with a straight edge from the fretted fingerboard just touching the top of the bridge?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 2:33 pm 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2006 2:35 pm
Posts: 2951
Location: United States
First name: Joe
Last Name: Beaver
City: Lake Forest
State: California
Focus: Build
I missed this tread way back when. Good job as usual Hesh my friend.

Turns out I've been thinking about the way I slope the upper bout. My biggest concern is to keep the planes of the plates parrellel. Your method seems to work well in that regard.

_________________
Joe Beaver
Maker of Sawdust



These users thanked the author Joe Beaver for the post: Hesh (Mon Feb 13, 2017 3:21 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Feb 13, 2017 3:23 pm 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13417
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
Joe Beaver wrote:
I missed this tread way back when. Good job as usual Hesh my friend.

Turns out I've been thinking about the way I slope the upper bout. My biggest concern is to keep the planes of the plates parrellel. Your method seems to work well in that regard.


Thanks Joe and I hope that you are doing great too!

I can't take credit, I'm just the guy who tried to distill it into something sequential that made sense to me. Martin does this and many others too. :)


Last edited by Hesh on Fri Feb 17, 2017 3:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2017 1:49 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:21 am
Posts: 3613
First name: Brad
Last Name: Combs
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
***Edit*** Scratch this, I see a question in the main forum with the same question and you answered there. :)


Hesh,

For ukes and small body guitars, just change the thickness of the shim so that the waist is touching the flat board before beginning sanding? I use a 30' radius on the top, so it isn't much to start and always but the UTB on flat anyway. But this I think will help with the hump and the minor gap below the FB.

Thanks for the tutorial!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

_________________
Insta - https://www.instagram.com/cbcguitars/
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/cbcguitars


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Feb 17, 2017 3:06 pm 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13417
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
bcombs510 wrote:
***Edit*** Scratch this, I see a question in the main forum with the same question and you answered there. :)


Hesh,

For ukes and small body guitars, just change the thickness of the shim so that the waist is touching the flat board before beginning sanding? I use a 30' radius on the top, so it isn't much to start and always but the UTB on flat anyway. But this I think will help with the hump and the minor gap below the FB.

Thanks for the tutorial!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Don't know but if it were me I would be drawing it out full scale on paper and then playing with getting the neck angle where I wanted by changing shim height.



These users thanked the author Hesh for the post: bcombs510 (Fri Feb 17, 2017 3:08 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 10:44 am 
Offline
Walnut
Walnut

Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2017 5:57 am
Posts: 6
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
First name: Jeff
Last Name: Jewitt
City: Cleveland
State: Ohio
Zip/Postal Code: 44102
Country: United States
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
I like this idea as I have had problems with the dreaded "ski jump". I tried it out today and my process was as follows.

1. Flat sand the rim - flat all way around. (before kerfing installed)
2. Sand a 30' radius from the waist down (marked with chalk before kerfing installed)

Install kerfing just a hair above rim

3. Sand 15' radius on back
4. Flat sand rim to sides marked with chalk
5. Sand 30' radius on top from waist down (this seemed require a lot of sanding for some reason)
3. Sand on a flat dish with the heel block raised 1/8". Just from the waist up. Like Hesh describes

A lot of kerfing was removed from the neck block area. Any idea of why so much was removed?


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

_________________
Jeff Jewitt
www.JewittGuitars.com
www.homesteadfinishingproducts.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu May 11, 2017 6:29 pm 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13417
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
Jeff I've looked at your pics and read your description a number of times today and I have no idea why your kerfed linings took such a hit. I'm also having a very hard time trying to reconcile what you wrote with the steps that I provided.....

The steps that you detail are not what I am describing. For example you said in your step one you flat sanded the rim all the way around. I don't do this and it's not described in my tutorial. Instead the tutorial begins with the rim having been entirely radiused in a radius dish and the kerfed linings installed (and also radiused).

You also detail as a step that you imparted a 15' radius on the back. I don't address the back at all.....

Anyway like many things words and details matter. My suggestion is to review the tutorial again and see where you did things differently.

Lastly early on you describe a problem with a "ski jump" and again that's not what this method seeks to address. What I wrote is that it addressed the dreaded body hump. As you can see I am having a lot of trouble understanding what you wrote and did.

Sorry, this is an unusual position for me to be in as I usually understand what folks are saying to me and am always keen to help. In this case I don't know what you did or why. None of it looks like the steps that I detailed.

I do want to help, as alway, I'm in the shop tomorrow between 10 and 5ish... if you want to call me, http://www.annarborguitars.com the number is on our site.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 12:31 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2008 12:17 pm
Posts: 1170
City: Escondido
State: CA
Zip/Postal Code: 92029
Country: USA
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
Hesh, are you building? I thought you had given that up as a game for suckers only! ;)



These users thanked the author rlrhett for the post: David Collins (Sat May 13, 2017 11:03 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat May 13, 2017 11:06 pm 
Offline
Brazilian Rosewood
Brazilian Rosewood

Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2005 10:04 am
Posts: 2060
rlrhett wrote:
Hesh, are you building? I thought you had given that up as a game for suckers only! ;)



Nah, I won't let him. Every time he thinks about doing anything like that, I point him to the work shelves filled with real money to be made in repairs. ;)

_________________
Eschew obfuscation, espouse elucidation.



These users thanked the author David Collins for the post (total 2): Hesh (Sun May 14, 2017 12:44 pm) • Clinchriver (Sun May 14, 2017 9:51 am)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2017 11:41 am 
Offline
Walnut
Walnut

Joined: Sun Apr 30, 2017 5:57 am
Posts: 6
Location: Cleveland, Ohio
First name: Jeff
Last Name: Jewitt
City: Cleveland
State: Ohio
Zip/Postal Code: 44102
Country: United States
Focus: Build
Status: Professional
Hesh - Sorry but I don't check here as often as I liked. My problem was that I was following a different procedure from someone and tried to incorporate yours at the end.
I removed the kerfing and re-did everything but I did not flat sand the top first. I domed it with the radius dish up to the waist and then flat sanded as you describe and it came out perfect.

_________________
Jeff Jewitt
www.JewittGuitars.com
www.homesteadfinishingproducts.com



These users thanked the author Jeff Jewitt for the post: Hesh (Fri Jun 16, 2017 11:47 am)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 5:20 am 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13417
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
Good going Jeff!

Yeah many of these methods which are not of course the only methods are highly dependent on precise methodology and deviating into another method and all bets are off.

Glad it worked out for you.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:10 pm 
Offline
Mahogany
Mahogany

Joined: Mon Sep 22, 2008 6:27 pm
Posts: 76
I want to thank you for this Tutorial. We all get something from somebody and its great to pass it on. This has solved my problems. I build with a 25' radius in the top and always ended up having to taper the underside of the fret board to fit the top after sanding a flat in the top.
I am curious what end angle to you cut into your neck heel before flossing it to fit?
Also do you fret your fingerboard before you glue it to the neck blank or after it is glued to the body?
Once again thank you for your kindness in sharing

fred



These users thanked the author frwilliams for the post: Hesh (Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:50 am)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:50 am 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13417
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
Thanks Fred, very glad that you found it useful.

I would cut the initial angle, all necks have to be fitted anyway, to 1.5 degrees and that always got me close.

We teach fret work and we teach it to professionals or hobbyists some who have been a Luthier for a very long time. To us it's imperative that guitars be fretted with the board installed on the neck and the neck installed on the guitar. Any body hump and complete control over fall-away is possible this way. The level of accuracy is also greatly enhanced so that very low action is truly possible.

Thanks for the kind comments!



These users thanked the author Hesh for the post: frwilliams (Mon Jan 22, 2018 5:05 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:10 am 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo

Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 5:31 am
Posts: 221
First name: Bob
Last Name: Orr
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
Thanks again Hesh for this great instructional post. Do you radius the rim first then attach the linings and then radius again or do you attach the linings before doing any radiusing of the top?

Bob



These users thanked the author Bob Orr for the post: Hesh (Thu Jan 04, 2018 9:38 am)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 9:23 am 
Offline
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
Old Growth Brazilian Rosewood
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:49 am
Posts: 13417
Location: Ann Arbor, Michigan
First name: Hesh
Last Name: Breakstone
City: Ann Arbor
State: Michigan
Country: United States
Status: Professional
Hey Bob!

I learned the hard way that I should radius first and then attach the linings something like 1/32nd" proud and drive the bus again for a minute of two.....;) I had been installing the linings and then sanding through all of that.... until the light bulb went off one day.

Toward the end of my "production building" I learned to hog off a lot of extra material from the neck and tail block too and in time my bus driving became minimal.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Jan 04, 2018 2:26 pm 
Offline
Cocobolo
Cocobolo

Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 5:31 am
Posts: 221
First name: Bob
Last Name: Orr
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
Thanks Hesh and makes a lot of sense as this will retain maximum height of linings. Cheers, Bob



These users thanked the author Bob Orr for the post: Hesh (Sat Jan 06, 2018 7:14 am)
Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 1:37 pm 
Offline
Koa
Koa

Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2018 9:19 am
Posts: 532
Location: St. Charles MO
First name: Karl
Last Name: Borum
State: MO
Zip/Postal Code: 63303
Country: United States
Focus: Build
Status: Amateur
Fantastic tutorial Hesh, thank you. Provides in part the missing explanation about why Cumpiano in GUITARMAKING TRADITION and TECHNOLOGY planes the neck block (p. 232 Step 7 - Removing the Headblock Discontinuity). This has been the most confusing part of the entire book for me as he switches his discussion and photos between back and top.

Your method and explanation are elegant and clear. Thanks again. Yesterday was nine years to the day since you first posted this toot.

_________________
Measure Twice,

Karl Borum


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2024 11:21 am 
Offline
Contributing Member
Contributing Member
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:44 am
Posts: 5505
First name: colin
Last Name: north
Country: Scotland.
Focus: Build
Status: Semi-pro
I know this has been here for a long time, but I've final got round to doing this - thanks Hesh.

_________________
The name catgut is confusing. There are two explanations for the mix up.

Catgut is an abbreviation of the word cattle gut. Gut strings are made from sheep or goat intestines, in the past even from horse, mule or donkey intestines.

Otherwise it could be from the word kitgut or kitstring. Kit meant fiddle, not kitten.



These users thanked the author Colin North for the post (total 3): bcombs510 (Sun Nov 24, 2024 10:55 am) • Kbore (Sun Nov 17, 2024 12:14 am) • Hesh (Tue Oct 29, 2024 10:08 pm)
Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 46 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
phpBB customization services by 2by2host.com