Official Luthiers Forum!

I'm getting close to finish time on a guitar I've been working on for some time. I think it wants to be gloss. The problem is I've never done much successful finishing with anything other than TruOil. It's been a go-to for a long time. I'd like to branch out, at least a little.

I don't have any spray equipment, but I've seen good results with Preval sprayers (http://www.homedepot.com/p/Preval-9-oz- ... W4i_soX-Sq). I'm just not so good at spraying yet. And it makes me nervous to try it on a guitar. I could, of course, learn French Polish, but I'd prefer something a bit tougher. So I've thought about trying another varnish. I am concerned I won't be able to get the gloss I'm looking for though.

I'm looking for advice. Bite the bullet, and learn to spray really quick? Run to Ace Hardware and buy some of that gloss varnish everyone seems to think highly of? Or just go with good old TruOil? Or...I dunno. Anybody care to weigh in?

Thanks in advance.,
David

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David Morris

Another alternative would be to make your own wipe on varnish with the Ace varnish. It's inexpensive and pretty foolproof. You can get a very nice gloss that way but it does take some time to build. It's also easy to put down a very even coat unlike brushing (or even spraying if your not good at it). Here's an article with some great advice. http://www.hardwoodlumberandmore.com/Articles/ArticleViewPage/tabid/75/ArticleId/5/Wipe-on-Varnish.aspx

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Ken Franklin
clumsy yet persistent
https://www.kenfranklinukulele.com

Rattle can lacquer from stew Mac or Behlins, both work well.

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Brian

You never know what you are capable of until you actually try.

https://www.howardguitarsdelaware.com/

One key to getting a good finish is the prep. Spruce won't need filling but the back and sides may. I don't fill maple or cherry. Most other woods will.
Any mistake under the finish may show up on the finish. I also recommend that you use the sealer from the manufacture or what they recommend. This is also about chemistry and finish compatibility. Getting a good base coat and allow cure time , level sanding finish coats level off buff polish.
It is easy just takes a lot of time . This is one thing you cannot rush

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John Hall
blues creek guitars
Authorized CF Martin Repair
Co President of ASIA
You Don't know what you don't know until you know it

I recommend brushed lacquer or rattle can lacquer. Both can be purchased at Lowes. I use Deft and although some people say it is not suitable for guitars for some reason, I have had no problems with 8 guitars and a ukulele. If you brush, the sanding takes longer since it does not go on as flat, but you can achieve an excellent finish with either brushed or rattle can lacquer. Here is a guitar I built and finished with Deft rattle cans:


And here is one I finished with Deft brushing lacquer:


I had zero experience finishing anything with lacquer prior to completing my first guitar. I learned it all from the internet and by myself. It was not hard at all. Lacquer is really forgiving, so if you mess up, just add more coats. You won't have to worry about witness lines with real nitrocellulose lacquer regardless of how long you wait between coats. Give lacquer a try. Just buy a good mask to protect yourself from the fumes. I bought my mask at Lowes as well. It is a 3M mask with VOC filters and it cost about $20. Good luck and post pics!

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http://www.CostaGuitars.com
PMoMC

your building skills are impeccable Tony you are doing a find job.

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John Hall
blues creek guitars
Authorized CF Martin Repair
Co President of ASIA
You Don't know what you don't know until you know it

+1 for rattle cans.

I've used Deft too, no problems yet. People say it's too brittle & is prone to cracking.

IMO it would be difficult to put on too much with rattle cans. It's already thinned a lot so that it will spray. I'd guess it would take in excess of 15 coats (or more) before it got too thick.

Kevin Looker

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I'm not a luthier.
I'm just a guy who builds guitars in his basement.
It's better than playing golf.

In my experience the problem with Deft is that it's too soft.

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Ken Franklin
clumsy yet persistent
https://www.kenfranklinukulele.com

I used rattle can lacquer on my first guitar. Couldn't have been easier. Do the prep well...like bluescreek says. There's no short cut there. When the surface you are spraying onto is perfectly sealed and flat...I think you'll be surprised how easy it is to spray a topcoat...any topcoat...and lacquer is the easiest, most forgiving topcoat of them all.

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I read Emerson on the can. A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds...true...but a consistent reading of Emerson has its uses nevertheless.

StuMusic

I found the Deft waterbourne lacquer to be soft - I don't know about the Deft Nitro...

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Steve Sollod (pronounced sorta like "Solid")
www.swiftcreekguitars.com

I'm working on the surface prep now. I'm grain filling with Timbermate, and I'm painting it black.

I really appreciate the advice. It sounds like it's high time I learned to spray lacquer. If I use a Preval sprayer, I'm not limited to rattle cans. Is there a good brand of lacquer to look for at HD/Lowe's/Ace? I have some in the shop, but I think it's pretty old.

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David Morris

A word of advice....how lacquer sprays and lays down is determined by pressure, orifice size, reducer ratio, and retarder ratio. All these variables are figured out by the manufacturers of the rattle can lacquer. Using a Preval you may need to develop a formula to get things to lay down nicely...which is the case with any spray system. I'd very much recommend using the Behlen's Musical Instrument lacquer in a rattle can on your first go. Woodcrafter sells this for sure...and StewMac does too...I think.

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I read Emerson on the can. A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds...true...but a consistent reading of Emerson has its uses nevertheless.

StuMusic

Here is a link to a finishing kit from Grizzly that uses Behlen products. Cost is $136.

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Guitar-Finishing-Kit/T21176

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Formerly known as Adaboy.......

That's excellent advice. I think Darryl's recommendation may be out of my price range, but I could certainly get a couple of $13.99 rattle cans. I might just drive down to Woodcraft this weekend.

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David Morris

I got the rattle from Lowes and HD. Mostly used a 3 turbine Wagner 2600 for years and was a great finish system. But what gets you there is doing it and fixing mistakes and doing it. Soon you get pretty good at it.

Just like every other step in building a guitar...

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David Morris

Ken,
Interesting! Have you used wipe-on on guitar? Picture would be great!
After pore filling, what do you seal it with prior to varnishing? You use any specific brand?
Any extra info appreciated!
Mark

I did a wipe on this winter when the weather wasn't so great for spraying. But I don't have any pictures. I sealed with shellac first. It didn't require pore filling since it was pau fero with a cherry neck.

I do have a picture of a friend's guitar with Ace varnish modified for wiping on. Came out nice. Only problem being that it took some time to build up. It was a retopped guitar for a friend and wasn't meant to be perfect but it came out pretty nice considering it wasn't buffed. The neck finish was original to the guitar.

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Ken Franklin
clumsy yet persistent
https://www.kenfranklinukulele.com

Ken,
Thanks for the info! Going to try that on a scrap piece and see how it does....

Ken,
That's a sweet rosette. Any pics of making it available?

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http://www.CostaGuitars.com
PMoMC

That one isn't mine, Tony. You'll have to ask Link.

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Ken Franklin
clumsy yet persistent
https://www.kenfranklinukulele.com

Tony

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Cut to size.....Beat to fit.....Paint to match.

That is a sweet rosette. Do you have pics of how you made it? I could probably guess, but it's Friday and I used up most of my available brain power earlier this week.

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http://www.CostaGuitars.com
PMoMC